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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles

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casper50
.400 member

Reged: 18/10/07
Posts: 1344
Loc: Alaska

.577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday
#377100 - 02/06/23 04:44 AM

Very happily surprised at the nice condition this one is in. Very good bores. Slugged at .582. manufactured in circa 1870, incorporates Charles Harvey's 1866 patented retractable strikers (166 use number). The firing pins are linked to brass blocks connected to each hammer and are non-rebounding. It has a beaded blade front sight, flat folding three-leaf rear sight (100, 200, and 300 yard leaves with inlaid sight lines),"WILKINSON & SON. GUN MAKERS TO HER MAJESTY. PALL MALL. LONDON" signed on the rib, two sets of London proofs (28 bore marking, not nitro), "WILKINSON & SON/No. 166/PATENT/1866." on top of the frame, "WILKINSON & SON" signed on each of the locks, sliding half-cock safeties, scroll and border engraving along with floral designs, "WILKINSON'S. PATENT./LEVER FORE END." on the forearm lever, "PATENT" on the rear forearm hardware, sling eyes on the rib and bottom of the buttstock, checkered forearm and straight wrist stock, and 14 1/4 inch length of pull. Why would one leaf not be permanent standing? Also when closing the under lever closes on it's own about 90%.

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Huvius
.416 member

Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3525
Loc: Colorado

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: casper50]
#377101 - 02/06/23 05:28 AM

WOW!
That is a very nice find!

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.

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NitroX
.700 member

Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39248
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: casper50]
#377104 - 02/06/23 07:07 AM

Quote:

It has a beaded blade front sight, flat folding three-leaf rear sight (100, 200, and 300 yard leaves with inlaid sight lines),"WILKINSON & SON. GUN MAKERS TO HER MAJESTY. PALL MALL. LONDON" signed on the rib,

Why would one leaf not be permanent standing?

I asked that same question on my 10-bore Westley Richards double rifle all folding leaves rear sight, I hoped it was going to be because it could be used for both ball and shot, but alas, just my ignorance,

I'll look it up edit and add. I believe it was suggested to be that way for very close shooting (?).

Very nice .577. Long barrels from the looks of them. More like a shotgun. From an era I suppose when the long barreled rifles were still the norm. How long are they?

One thing I like is the action size. Modern .577 NEs often have that very heavy bulky action size. This ,577 BPE looks quite petite.

Edited:

Quote:

I doubt they were thinking shot/ball, the all-folding sights likely were to facilitate 'point-blank' shooting.

http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=194053&an=&page=0&vc=1

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Edited by NitroX (02/06/23 07:25 AM)

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degoins
.333 member

Reged: 28/02/06
Posts: 427
Loc: SC, USA

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: NitroX]
#377126 - 03/06/23 12:06 AM

Beautiful!!! I love those retractible strikers.

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casper50
.400 member

Reged: 18/10/07
Posts: 1344
Loc: Alaska

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: degoins]
#377128 - 03/06/23 01:42 AM

John they are 28".

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3DogMike
.400 member

Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1414
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: casper50]
#377129 - 03/06/23 02:08 AM

Quote:

John they are 28".

Perfect length in my opinion…..no “carbines” in my collection

BTW: what does the rifle weigh?

- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields

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casper50
.400 member

Reged: 18/10/07
Posts: 1344
Loc: Alaska

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: 3DogMike]
#377130 - 03/06/23 02:22 AM

postal scale says 8lbs 2ozs.

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tinker
.416 member

Reged: 12/03/05
Posts: 4835
Loc: Nevada

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: casper50]
#377131 - 03/06/23 03:49 AM

Looking really good

I look forward to seeing your field report

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--

"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...

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93x64mm
.416 member

Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 3987
Loc: Nth QLD Australia

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: tinker]
#377138 - 03/06/23 08:07 AM

Very nice acquisition Casper!
She a grand old piece, beautiful engraving & the Damascus figuring is superb!

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CJF
.300 member

Reged: 07/08/17
Posts: 216
Loc: United States

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: 93x64mm]
#377148 - 04/06/23 02:50 AM

What a beautiful rifle and in wonderful condition too. Congratulations!

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85lc
.375 member

Reged: 19/01/18
Posts: 915
Loc: Georgia, USA

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: CJF]
#377151 - 04/06/23 05:27 AM

casper50,

RE: "Why would one leaf not be permanent standing?" I was told that some early rifles and also paradox guns did not have a standing lief for close up shooting because the intent was to shoot them like a shotgun, looking at the animal and not the sights.

--------------------
RB

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TH44
.375 member

Reged: 21/02/09
Posts: 731
Loc: West UK

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: 85lc]
#377155 - 04/06/23 10:14 AM

That is a seriously nice rifle

IMHO the early hammer doubles are most interesting, straight stock with finger rest, non rebounding locks with "stalking" safeties all point to an early rifle
The brass blocks and very unusual hammers are a bonus
Clear Damascus figuring and the foliate engraving all point to a top class rifle

Wilkinsons apparently did not produce many DRs (I only have a Howdah pistol by them)
Only one of my DRs has the fold flat sights a .450/400
Is it 2 3/4" or 3" case? (or even 3 1/4")?
A very good catch indeed
Hope you have fun shooting it

TH

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casper50
.400 member

Reged: 18/10/07
Posts: 1344
Loc: Alaska

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: TH44]
#377156 - 04/06/23 11:56 AM

It's 3.175 from rim end of chamber to the rifling. I've been told it was most likely a 2.5" that was rechambered when they stopped production of 2.5" .577. It has an extremely slow twist, 1 in 96" approximately.

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TH44
.375 member

Reged: 21/02/09
Posts: 731
Loc: West UK

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: casper50]
#377179 - 06/06/23 09:20 AM

That adds up as it would be very light for a 3 inch chamber

My early Williams & Powell DR in .577 Snider is 8lb 7 oz.

My .577 3" is 12 lb

1 in 96" is very slow twist

I am sure you will start off with light loads as recoil could be "stout`"!

I hope you don't mind me mentioning that Black Powder is what it was designed for

Should you use Nitro for Black magnum primers and filler rod/packing for such a large case

Good shooting!

TH

Edited by TH44 (06/06/23 09:22 AM)

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3DogMike
.400 member

Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1414
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: TH44]
#377180 - 06/06/23 09:46 AM

"….with light loads as recoil could be "stout`"!…."
TH, you have the gift of understatement

70 grains of 2F Black & 450-480 grain bullet to start would be a good idea.

I have a Steven Grant .577 from 1873 that is a 3" but undoubtedly was one of the shorter cases when new. It weighs 8lb 4oz and really surprised me when I tried the period load for the .577 2 1/2' of 110 grains with a 560 grain bullet……only did that for 2 shots! Now use an ~85 grain and 480 grain bullet and it is much more "civilized". (can I say that word "civilized'? White privilege and all you know)

Cannot imagine a "period correct" .577 3" load of 160+ grains of black and a 560-590 grain bullet…….

My guess is that the conversion to the 3" case explains why the bores are in such good shape….the owners shot them little if at all.....did not want to loose their teeth and break their noses with their thumbs.

- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields

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casper50
.400 member

Reged: 18/10/07
Posts: 1344
Loc: Alaska

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: 3DogMike]
#377182 - 06/06/23 01:33 PM

My question is if it was rechambered to the 3" would it have been reregulated for it as well?

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NitroX
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Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39248
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: 85lc]
#377185 - 06/06/23 04:09 PM

Quote:

casper50,

RE: "Why would one leaf not be permanent standing?" I was told that some early rifles and also paradox guns did not have a standing lief for close up shooting because the intent was to shoot them like a shotgun, looking at the animal and not the sights.

Makes sense. Whether the practice makes sense, shooting bullets without rear sights, only actual use would tell. Practicing with it like that and depending on fit might work. Or just raise the rear leaf.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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NitroX
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Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39248
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: casper50]
#377186 - 06/06/23 04:15 PM

Quote:

My question is if it was rechambered to the 3" would it have been reregulated for it as well?

One would hope!

Btw reading all the comments about heavy loads, lighthouses etc, how does the regulation work with all sorts of bullet weights, and powder loads?

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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3DogMike
.400 member

Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1414
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: casper50]
#377192 - 07/06/23 02:58 AM

Quote:

My question is if it was rechambered to the 3" would it have been reregulated for it as well?

One would assume that to be the case, but you never know. Just have to shoot it to see how it goes.

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields

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MikeRowe
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Reged: 23/11/11
Posts: 478
Loc: Arkansas, USA

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: 3DogMike]
#377196 - 07/06/23 12:26 PM

I think you will find that the strikers are gold plated - not brass blocks.
I worked on an almost identical rifle many years ago - it still had 2 1/2" chambers, and shot a case full of black and a round ball quite splendidly.
You may try a round ball load in this rifle - it does make the recoil much more pleasant.

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Kynoch
.224 member

Reged: 11/02/05
Posts: 40
Loc: Iowa, United States

Re: .577 Wilkenson & Son arrived yesterday [Re: MikeRowe]
#377251 - 12/06/23 03:35 AM

Very lovely rifle. I would second the use or round ball given that slow rate of twist and weight. Track of the Wolf sells .580 round balls that would be close to what you need and you could try without having to invest in a mould. Congratulations on the purchase and keep us posted!

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