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NitroXAdministrator
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The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge
      #326934 - 07/04/19 04:59 AM

The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge and Rising Bite Double Rifles in the new .416R cartridge

Marc Newton, CEO of John Rigby recently saw the posts here on NE and sent me an email with news of the new Rigby cartridge, the .416 No. 2 Rimmed Rigby.

A great new development, and making a great choice for a medium-big bore double rifle chambering.
Basically the same rimless .416 Rigby cartridge with a rim. Quite a hot double rifle cartridge.

THE .416 Rigby cartridge pushes a 400 gr projectile at 2,350 fps to over 2,400 fps. The other main rimmed .416 was also modern, the .500/416 Nitro Express cartridge, drives a 400 gr bullet at approximately 2,325 fps. So the Rigby Rimmed and 500/416 NE will deliver very similar performances, both being relatively hot cartridges in break open rifles. But I have no doubt the .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby will be a great success and eagerly sought after as a break open and double rifle cartridge.



The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge is basically the rimless . 416 Rigby with an added rim ideal for break open rifles. Promising to be a great new cartridge of choice in double rifles.

Rigby Rising Bites are already being made by John Rigby & Co. in the new new cartridge chambering.





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John aka NitroX

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Ripp
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: NitroX]
      #326936 - 07/04/19 05:08 AM

Man that is a beautiful rifle...

Great ballistics out of the new .416...

Personally love the .416 caliber..

Ripp

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DarylS
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Ripp]
      #326938 - 07/04/19 06:57 AM

Yes- lovely indeed.

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Daryl


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93x64mm
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: DarylS]
      #326944 - 07/04/19 08:03 AM

Is that a Woodleigh 'capped' hydro in that cartridge?
Amazing work on that rifle - but I'd be too scared to take it out in the rough stuff!


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Ripp
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: 93x64mm]
      #326952 - 07/04/19 12:23 PM

Quote:

Is that a Woodleigh 'capped' hydro in that cartridge?
Amazing work on that rifle - but I'd be too scared to take it out in the rough stuff!




Went to their website.. prices start at...

Starting from
£118,200

If you can afford that, a scratch or two would not be that big of a deal..

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Rockdoc
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Ripp]
      #326953 - 07/04/19 12:27 PM

How different is it from the 500/416?

What head size is it based on? 500?


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Rule303
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Rockdoc]
      #326954 - 07/04/19 12:49 PM

Quote:

How different is it from the 500/416?

What head size is it based on? 500?




Same ballistics as each other.

Which case head are you talking about, the 500/416 or the 416Rimmed Rigby? If the Rigby then it is the same head size as a 416Rigby if the 500/416 I do not know. Have to look it up.

Good on Rigby for developing the new cartridge. Though I note the 416 Rimed developed by A Square in the early 90's is a blown out and lengthen 416 Rigby case designed specifically for double rifles. I do not think you can find these any more. I hope the new Rigby cartridge succeeds where the A Square did not.

Edited by Rule303 (07/04/19 12:58 PM)


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Ahmed577
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Rule303]
      #326965 - 07/04/19 10:18 PM

Non high gloss polish finish is the way to go.

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Rule303
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Ahmed577]
      #326977 - 08/04/19 09:16 AM

Quote:

Non high gloss polish finish is the way to go.




Agreed 100%


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lancaster
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Rule303]
      #327003 - 09/04/19 04:27 AM

another new cartridge that ends as a number in cartridge collector boxes

please not!

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: lancaster]
      #327005 - 09/04/19 04:44 AM

Quote:

another new cartridge that ends as a number in cartridge collector boxes

please not!




I don't think this one will end up as just a case for collections.

It will become the most effective ".400" range break open rifle cartridge. And as a rimmed example very suitable. The most powerful ".400" joining the .450/400's, and the .500/416.

I think in a Rigby double a much to be desired chambering.

And also in future single shot rifles.

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baileybradshaw
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: NitroX]
      #328866 - 27/05/19 12:57 PM

Performance is certainly worth looking at. Impressive ballistics. If Hornady or another major ammo mfg loads it I wouldn't hesitate to chamber rifles for it.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: baileybradshaw]
      #328876 - 27/05/19 03:38 PM

Quote:

Performance is certainly worth looking at. Impressive ballistics. If Hornady or another major ammo mfg loads it I wouldn't hesitate to chamber rifles for it.




Hopefully we will see it spread. And it will only be a general commercial success if mainstream US ammo makers cater for it, or at the usual ammo makers for unusual big bores such as Norma, Hornady etc.

And if some gunmakers also cater for it. Bringing the cartridge into the affordability of common gunowners. Maybe a Ruger no.1 could be chambered for it?

Being a rimmed cartridge, makes it less likely in cheaper firearms, as it is usually only the break open and similar actions which use the rimmed cartridges. Single shots and doubles.

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Ripp
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: NitroX]
      #328894 - 28/05/19 12:33 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Performance is certainly worth looking at. Impressive ballistics. If Hornady or another major ammo mfg loads it I wouldn't hesitate to chamber rifles for it.




Hopefully we will see it spread. And it will only be a general commercial success if mainstream US ammo makers cater for it, or at the usual ammo makers for unusual big bores such as Norma, Hornady etc.

And if some gunmakers also cater for it. Bringing the cartridge into the affordability of common gunowners. Maybe a Ruger no.1 could be chambered for it?

Being a rimmed cartridge, makes it less likely in cheaper firearms, as it is usually only the break open and similar actions which use the rimmed cartridges. Single shots and doubles.




This would be an awesome cartridge to use around Africa.. IMHO.. very good ballistics and as much knockdown energy you should ever need.. 400 gr bullet at 2350-2400FPS.. that equates to over 5000ft.lbs of energy at the muzzle..

As you state, if other larger ammo manufacturers were to pick it up that would certainly insure its future success...

--------------------
ALL MEN DIE, BUT FEW MEN TRULY LIVE..

Edited by Ripp (28/05/19 12:34 AM)


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rigbymauser
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Ripp]
      #328911 - 28/05/19 04:30 AM

A.450 Nitro would do just fine.

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bouldersmith
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: rigbymauser]
      #328916 - 28/05/19 05:13 AM

Quote:

A.450 Nitro would do just fine.




The first and still the best dangerous game round if you ask me, and nothing more appropriate in a Rigby.

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Jaguarhunter
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: bouldersmith]
      #328996 - 30/05/19 05:49 PM

Rigby to release new calibre: the .416 Rigby No. 2

More than two decades after the development of their last cartridge, London gunmaker John Rigby & Co. is set to release a new calibre, the .416 Rigby No. 2, which will be chambered in Rigby’s Rising Bite double rifles.

Dr. Eckhard Stief, a passionate German hunter, rifle collector and avid fan of rifles, is the genius behind the design of this new and improved .416 Rigby No. 2 cartridge. Working hand-in-hand with Rigby, he has seen through the development of the new calibre from concept.

As a keen cartridge developer, Dr. Stief has previously improved calibres for medium and small-sized game but four years ago decided that he would like to work on one last project - to develop an improved, more modern calibre for big game, so struck up the alliance with Rigby to see through the project.

A fan of the .416 Rigby, Dr. Stief maintains that John Rigby who developed the original cartridge in 1911 was ahead of his time when he produced the calibre, adding that it can be compared to new modern age cartridges.

Using the .416 Rigby’s original design, Dr. Stief has simply added a rim to the cartridge, to improve the extraction in double rifles, maintaining the same cartridge pressures and velocities.

Dr. Stief commented: “I selected the .416 Rigby for development because it’s powerful for shooting big game and penetrates well but it can also be used on medium-sized game like kudu and oryx, making it a good all-rounder. For me the modern shape of the case and good shoulder is important, plus the neck is not so long like many older calibres and there is lots of bullets readily available. By not changing the mother cartridge, reloaders can use their normal reloading full die set, simply needing a new case holder and original published reloading data can be used, so long as their rifle is chambered for the calibre. I have simply selected today’s best calibre from the big game calibre group and added a rim, aiding cartridge extraction.”

Marc Newton, the managing director of Rigby, added: “We are delighted to work with Dr. Stief, to develop a new Rigby calibre for our Rising Bite rifles. By adding a rim to the original .416 Rigby it modernises the cartridge and brings it into 21st century.”


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Jaguarhunter
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Jaguarhunter]
      #328997 - 30/05/19 05:54 PM

[img]https://up.picr.de/35873632xp.jpeg[/img]

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Jaguarhunter]
      #329425 - 17/06/19 11:33 PM



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John aka NitroX

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Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
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Postman
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: NitroX]
      #329430 - 18/06/19 02:10 AM

What kind of up-take has the Kreighoff 500-416 seen? Surely a good cartridge as well, although the Rigby name is more romantically synonymous with the .416. In any event, I do hope that this cartridge actually gets some traction, but I’d hazard a guess that it, like most newly introduced big bore cartridges will have to really fight for relevance. The big bore market is extremely tiny comparatively speaking to the overall shooting sports market. This fact of low volume economics will make it VERY difficult for newcomers to encroach on an already very small market where even old established players are not easily available at the corner sporting goods store.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Postman]
      #329431 - 18/06/19 02:33 AM

I think people misunderstand the market. As long as Rigby exists and they are willing to chamber this cartridge, it will exist. It doesn't need a hundred rifles a year being chambered in it to be a success. As the value and price of the rifles will always be a custom proposition.

The cartridge is an effective for purpose choice. So that is not a question.

The only question will be how widespread it becomes if off the shelf and other makers choose or not to take it up. For example I would love one. But could never afford the London Best Rising Bite price. Conceivably a Verney-Carron, Heym or other similar brand might be achievable. Same for many other potential users.

Ammunition must already be available for it, at a price and order. Many of us ONLY reload. Ammunition makers will follow success.

The .416 No.2 Rigby has the name to draw upon.

Unlike Holland & Holland and the .400 H&H Magnum, H&H makes only a handfull of rifles each year, Rigby is making a relative lot at the prices they charge.

Krieghof's .500/416 NE was disappointing even though a few other makers chambered for it. Probably ballistically the same as the no.2. I think the Rigby name will make the difference.

Yep, the big bore market is small. Premium makers do not always depend on large numbers.

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John aka NitroX

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"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
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Huvius
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: NitroX]
      #329557 - 22/06/19 05:38 AM

While perusing the interwebs, I came across a Ruger No.1 chambered in the 416/470 cartridge. That is, a 470NE necked down to 416.
Thinking this must be a fairly recent development, I looked into it further and came up with this:

https://www.africahunting.com/threads/416-470-sxs-double-rifle-john-rigby-co.2743/

So, I guess Rigby had done this well before the 500/416 which is similar but 1/4" shorter and of course the new 416 No.2 which, in length, is somewhere in between and dimensionally the same as the rimless 416 Rigby.

Which brings us to this:
http://www.cartridgecollector.net/416-flanged-magnum



And this:
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/807208602



So, maybe 'ol Butch Searcy beat Rigby and Dr. Stief to the 416 No.2 quite a few years ago!

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Yochanan
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Huvius]
      #329581 - 22/06/19 11:45 PM

Interesting cartridge. So all the doubles in 416 Rigby can now easily be converted to 416 No.2 with a simple broaching job and modifying the extrators.

--------------------
© "I have never been able to appreciate 'shock' as applied to killing big game. It seems to me that you cannot kill an elephant weighing six tons by ´shock´unless you advocate the use of a field gun." - W.D.M. Bell: Wanderings of an Elephant Hunter.


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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: Huvius]
      #329583 - 23/06/19 01:18 AM

Quote:

While perusing the interwebs, I came across a Ruger No.1 chambered in the 416/470 cartridge. That is, a 470NE necked down to 416.
Thinking this must be a fairly recent development, I looked into it further and came up with this:

https://www.africahunting.com/threads/416-470-sxs-double-rifle-john-rigby-co.2743/

So, I guess Rigby had done this well before the 500/416 which is similar but 1/4" shorter and of course the new 416 No.2 which, in length, is somewhere in between and dimensionally the same as the rimless 416 Rigby.




No it doesn't say that. That rifle was chambered for a .416 Rigby ie rimless. The barrel was shot out and re-bored to 470 NE and a new set of .416 Rigby rimless barrels made for it. And the rifle reconditioned.

It was never a .470/416, but two sets of barrels. And Rigby admitted per comments it was the only .416 Rigby double rifle they had ever made. To that point ...

Quote:

Which brings us to this:
http://www.cartridgecollector.net/416-flanged-magnum



And this:
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/807208602



So, maybe 'ol Butch Searcy beat Rigby and Dr. Stief to the 416 No.2 quite a few years ago!




Again the link says the "Searcy" rifle was for a Ruger no.1 chambering.

Secondly was this flanged cartridge a .416 Rigby flanged? Or just another flanged NE cartridge necked down to .416? What is the parent case and ballistics? I will ask Bruce Bertram.

Lastly, a "rimmed .416" is of course not new. The .500/416 is a commercially available rimmed .416 and still chambered.

As of "ol'Searcy" its pretty good his "ol" rifles don't have to be sent out of the USA for repairs ... from reports, two to three times or more for some rifles, before being sold on ...

--------------------
John aka NitroX

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"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
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Huvius
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Re: The New .416 No.2 Rimmed Rigby Cartridge [Re: NitroX]
      #329585 - 23/06/19 02:14 AM

I didn't see the post where the history of the rifle was better explained.
All clear now... my mistake.

As for the Bertram brass, let us know what Bruce has to say.

--------------------
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