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mickey
.416 member


Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Death by Double rifle
      #21435 - 29/11/04 02:27 PM

I just watched 'Death by Double Rifle' on a CD. An interesting video whith shots on Buffalo and Elephant with a 450/400 3 1/4, a 470 and a 577. Some interesting shooting and some terrible shooting.

Not enough info on the rifles for me. In fact they were barely mentioned as to type etc and not many actual pictures.

All in all worth watching but not worth buying.

Just MHO.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.


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4seventy
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Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
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Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: mickey]
      #21453 - 29/11/04 08:31 PM

In reply to:

Not enough info on the rifles for me




Yeah, I thought the same after watching it.




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iqbal
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Reged: 05/02/03
Posts: 778
Loc: Karachi,Pakistan
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: 4seventy]
      #21471 - 30/11/04 04:23 AM

I think it dragged a bit,what with the PH going on and on after the hunt.Nevertheless it was good to watch.

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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39257
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: iqbal]
      #21485 - 30/11/04 09:43 AM

I enjoyed it too. But this thread provides a good excuse to watch it a second time.

What bugs me is their logo graphic. I think I know where the idea came from!



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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DUGABOY1
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Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
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Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: mickey]
      #21506 - 30/11/04 02:44 PM

In reply to:

I just watched 'Death by Double Rifle' on a CD. An interesting video whith shots on Buffalo and Elephant with a 450/400 3 1/4, a 470 and a 577.




The whole tape was a 21 day hunt with only double rifles! I believe in addtion to the ones mentioned above there was a 375 H&H double with a scope mounted.

In reply to:

Some interesting shooting and some terrible shooting.




That was my impression, as well! Some of the shots were simply amazing, and some were pure knee jerk placements!

In reply to:

Not enough info on the rifles for me. In fact they were barely mentioned as to type etc and not many actual pictures.




This is my complaint with most of the films about hunting in Africa! Most of the hunters who are intrested in hunting Africa, are as much shooters, as they are hunters. Especially, young hunters are very interested in what rifles are used, and in the sound reasons for that choice.

On most films, there seems to be a lack of concern, or even general knowledge about rifles amoung most film makers, as well as PHs. It seems what ever they use is fine, and the client should be able to hit a 3" dot painted on a cardboard box at 100 yds, over the bonnet of a Toyota. That client should use a 375 H&H bolt rifle, no matter what the type of action, or sights, as long as there is a scope! None of this is all bad, a PH who uses the same rifle for 30 yrs, is bound to get where he can shoot it. However, a client that doesn't know somthing about the rifles he is to depend on to guard his life, feels confident in trusting a PH to drag his nuts out of the fire! The film makers, think, it seems, that the only thing people want to see is an animal get shot. What with, doesn't seem to strike the film maker as important to the viewer.

--------------------
..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"


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Jase
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Reged: 01/11/04
Posts: 8
Loc: Sydney, Australia
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: mickey]
      #21511 - 30/11/04 03:26 PM

Are there any preview snippets around i can view before buying one of the dvd's?

--------------------
cheers
Jase


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NitroXAdministrator
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Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39257
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Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: mickey]
      #21514 - 30/11/04 04:31 PM

In reply to:

Not enough info on the rifles for me. In fact they were barely mentioned as to type etc and not many actual pictures.




From their website.

In reply to:

THE GUNS
.
600 NITRO EXPRESS
.
- 900 grain bullet
- 1,950 F.P.S.
- 7,600 F.P. Muzzle Energy
- Developed in 1900 to be the ultimate elephant stopper
- a true smokeless cartridge with no plackpowder heritage
- a .600 double will weigh 16 to 18 pounds
.
.
.
.577 Nitro Express
.
- 750 grain bullet
- 2,050 F.P.S.
- 7,020 F.P. Muzzle Energy
- the weapon of choice for many historic elephant hunters including Southerland, Pearson, Anderson, and Banks
- John Taylor recommended it as a second gun - to be carried by someone else!
.
.
.
.470 Nitro Express
.
- 500 grain bullet
- 2,150 F.P.S.
- 5,140 F.P. Muzzle Energy
- a .500 NE case necked down to a .470
- more doubles in this caliber than any other
- John Taylor killed more than 100 elephants with this cartridge, which he described as a "splendidly balanced cartridge".
- Robert Ruark's novels highlighted a Westley Richards .470 NE double
.
.
.
.460 Weatherby Magnum
.
- 500 grain bullet
- 2,700 F.P.S.
- 8,095 F.P. Muzzle Energy
- still the most powerful commercial cartridge available
- introduced by Roy Weatherby in 1958
- introduced by Roy Weatherby in 1958
.
.
.
.450/400 Nitro Express (3 Inch)
.
- 400 grain bullet
- 2,150 F.P.S.
- 4,110 F.P. Muzzle Energy
- John Taylor's favorite cartridge for Cape Buffalo
- inspiration for the .404 Jeffrey cartidge developed for bolt actions
- one of Britain's first smokeless loadings
- the choice of India's Tiger hunters, namely Jim Corbett
.
.
.
.375 H&H Magnum
.
- 300 grain bullet
- 2,530 F.P.S.
- 3,850 F.P. Muzzle Energy
- developed in 1912
- actually a "medium" bore, but can effectively pinch hit for the big bores.




Still not much information.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"


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500grains
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Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: NitroX]
      #21599 - 02/12/04 02:13 PM

I wonder why anyone would think the .460 Weatherby is the "most powerful commercial cartridge". Was the 700 Nitro Express made just for charity and is therefore not "commercial"? Is A-Square not a commercial entity which sells the 577 Tyrannosaur?


It is also unclear why anyone would equate "power" with "muzzle energy", since muzzle energy is often not a good indicator of killing ability.


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Chasseur
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Reged: 18/11/03
Posts: 771
Loc: Hunting classic Indian game!
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: 500grains]
      #21607 - 02/12/04 03:52 PM

I have a copy.

Like other I am mixed on the video, I really parts of it, but don' like others. I did like the idea of a long safari with only double. That elephant charge was sure exciting.

Not that I am a great shot or anything but there really were some questionable shots taken. Makes me wonder why there were left in a movie to be sold...

Also, not to sound snobbish but there is really something I don't like about the "tone/style" of many of the safari videos (say like the M. Sulliven ones...). Its just that the corny naration and music reminds me of those cable monster truck rally adds you see late at night (you know the ones, "SUNDAY!!!SUNDAY!!! ONE DAY ONLY, SATURDAY AND SUNDAY, SEE THE AMAZING TRUCKS CRUSH 20 YUGOS!!! or something to that effect), or the format of professional wrestling on pay for view. Its just when I think of Africa and double rifles, I think of TR, the Blixens, Hemingway and Ruark, not of monster truck rallies and professional wrestling...

Just my thoughts

--------------------
In regards to action he should devote himself to hunting...
-Machiavelli



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AussieMike
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Reged: 01/09/04
Posts: 236
Loc: Southern Tablelands, NSW, Aust...
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: Chasseur]
      #21614 - 02/12/04 08:50 PM

The problem I have with most hunting video's is that they make it into an adventure and an adventure, to me, is another name for a stuff up resulting from poor planning and inadequate skills.

AussieMike


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tunofun
.300 member


Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 120
Loc: Darwin, NT, Australia
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: AussieMike]
      #21619 - 02/12/04 09:36 PM

Gee, that's a bit harsh AussieMike, I always thought an adventure was just a remarkable happening or something way out of the ordinary. I did a hike a few years ago that was about 140km with only the food I was carrying and my bow, I thought that was pretty adventurous! Kokoda Trail is next on my list and I believe that is a major adventure to undertake!

I agree that hunting videos blow stuff out of proportion, but only in dangerous game senarios, check out a bow hunting video I think you will like the change!

--------------------

"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity."
Sigmund Freud -- General Introduction to Psychoanalysis


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AussieMike
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Reged: 01/09/04
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Loc: Southern Tablelands, NSW, Aust...
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: tunofun]
      #21649 - 03/12/04 11:43 PM

tunofun,if you walked 140km with food and bow and had food left at the end I'd say your trip was well planned.

I've had a few disasters (broken up a couple of canoes and had to walk out, lost on a new property for three days (it was a 1,000,000 acre place, bogged 4wds in numerous places etc) with no problems because I've had the gear, water, maps etc and one adventure when my PH and I followed a wounded cape buff into thick scrub and no-one thought to wonder where his mate had gone. We also had a trainee PH so had a 375, 458 and 470 all pointing the wrong way (by more than 90 degrees) when the unwounded mate arrived.

mike


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AfricanHunter
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Reged: 01/02/04
Posts: 60
Loc: Nebraska, USA
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: mickey]
      #21714 - 05/12/04 10:05 AM

Well, I am guilty of buying it last year at SCI in Reno.

I like the part where they show a closeup of a Westley Richards (gold name grade) with the guy dropping what looks like .577 Nitros into the chanbers while they are talking about using a .470 Francotte for the hunt, I think on the elephant if I remember correctly the sequence.


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SteveM
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Reged: 20/08/04
Posts: 33
Loc: Alberta, CAN
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: mickey]
      #21985 - 09/12/04 06:59 AM

I did buy it off the internet and enjoyed it. Thought some of the shooting was questionable as others have mentioned but am not going to criticize anyone until I've been in similar situations with similar equipment (I've made shots I'm not so proud of either). Was the first video I had bought with so many doubles being used so was worthwhile for me for the equipment if nothing else.

SteveM


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cr500
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Reged: 11/10/03
Posts: 213
Loc: Singleton ,Australia
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: mickey]
      #23171 - 02/01/05 02:05 PM

I was looking at getting this DVD until I got "Death at my feet". It showed good charges and so on ,but its certainly not what I would show to some one when they ask what hunting is all about. When my hunting partner came round to watch it ,he dragged his missus along. I dont think she is too impressed with hunting now.

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Rusty
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Loc: Missouri City, Texas
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: cr500]
      #23202 - 02/01/05 11:56 PM

I was given a copy of "DBDR". I too thought it was the best double rifle hunting video I had seen. It wasn't perfect, but hey which ones are?

I most certainly thought that they did not exploit wounded animals the way Sullivan seems to do.

Having said that, the best hunting video I have ever seen is the hippo charge from Sullivan's "Death on the Run" (I think that is the title?). That Hippo could have gone anywhere out of that pool where they found him. He wasn't wounded, he was just pissed off. He left the pool quatering away from the hunters. After he cleared the pool he came back toward the guys who had disturbed him. He was coming to kick those guys asses!

The client, can't remember his name, stands his ground, hits the hippo with a round out of his, I think 450/400 3 inch. The bullets impact is clearly visable in the footage, However, the bullet misses the brain. The hippo, just dips to his right a bit at the shot, and keeps on coming. Sullivan settles it with the 600 NE he is carrying. The hippo falls within 3-5 feet of the client with a resounding PLOP/THUD.

Coming down from that adrenalin rush must have been like fallen off a cliff! Yikes!

--------------------
Rusty
We band of brothers!

DRSS


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clark7781
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Reged: 28/10/04
Posts: 612
Loc: Fairfax County, Virginia, USA
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: Rusty]
      #23224 - 03/01/05 07:26 AM

Rusty:

I agree, that hippo charge was really cool. But I too do not agree with Sullivan's views of letting a wounded animal remain wounded in the hopes that it was charge. All BS and done purely for the camera.

I think it is the duty of the hunter to end his/her prey's life as quickly as possible without unwarranted suffering.

Just my two cents.

--------------------
Clark

Double Rifle Shooters Society
.500 NE and .577 NE


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4seventy
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Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
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Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: Rusty]
      #23229 - 03/01/05 09:27 AM

In reply to:

The client, can't remember his name, stands his ground, hits the hippo with a round out of his, I think 450/400 3 inch. The bullets impact is clearly visable in the footage, However, the bullet misses the brain. The hippo, just dips to his right a bit at the shot, and keeps on coming. Sullivan settles it with the 600 NE he is carrying. The hippo falls within 3-5 feet of the client with a resounding PLOP/THUD.




Rusty,
Yeah, a nice piece of footage for sure and very well filmed.
Top marks to the camera dude.

Regarding the rifles used, the client had a bolt action but I don't know the chambering. Doubtfull that in a boltgun it would be 450-400 3" though.
Also Sullivan was not using his 600 NE on that particular hunt.
In that hippo charge he used his Lang 450 No2 NE.


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4seventy
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Reged: 07/05/03
Posts: 2210
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Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: cr500]
      #23231 - 03/01/05 09:32 AM

In reply to:

I was looking at getting this DVD until I got "Death at my feet". It showed good charges and so on ,but its certainly not what I would show to some one when they ask what hunting is all about. When my hunting partner came round to watch it ,he dragged his missus along. I dont think she is too impressed with hunting now.





cr, the titles of the two videos "Death at my Feet" and "Death by Double Rifle" might suggest that they are by the same production company.
They ARE NOT.
Two different mobs completely.
Two very different hunting styles.


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cr500
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Reged: 11/10/03
Posts: 213
Loc: Singleton ,Australia
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: 4seventy]
      #23234 - 03/01/05 10:30 AM

WEll bugger it 4seventy ,looks like I might have to get the DVD. Ive just ordered a few more African hunting videos a few days ago as well.

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Rusty
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Reged: 08/02/03
Posts: 464
Loc: Missouri City, Texas
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: 4seventy]
      #23236 - 03/01/05 11:15 AM

4seventy, you are probably right. I'll look at the video again tomorrow and see about the client's rifle.



--------------------
Rusty
We band of brothers!

DRSS


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cr500
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Reged: 11/10/03
Posts: 213
Loc: Singleton ,Australia
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: mickey]
      #23241 - 03/01/05 11:46 AM

Are there any other recommendations for good African hunting videos? Ones which show some good up close stuff and plenty of hunting? Which are your favourites?

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DUGABOY1
.400 member


Reged: 02/02/03
Posts: 1340
Loc: TEXAS USA
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: cr500]
      #23243 - 03/01/05 12:23 PM

"Hunters and Ivory" , "Dangerous Game and Double Rifles" and "With Deadly Intent" , are three pretty good videos, with real hunting in them! If you like double rifles there is plenty of footage in these three tapes!

--------------------
..........Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY1, and MacD37 founding member of DRSS www.doublerifleshooterssociety.com
"If I die today, I have had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"


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cr500
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Reged: 11/10/03
Posts: 213
Loc: Singleton ,Australia
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #23282 - 03/01/05 05:44 PM

I have "with deadly intent " ordered already so I,m glad its a good one.

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Rusty
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Reged: 08/02/03
Posts: 464
Loc: Missouri City, Texas
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: 4seventy]
      #23293 - 03/01/05 08:29 PM

4seventy,
Look at the tape this morning and you are correct on both accounts! Thanks!

--------------------
Rusty
We band of brothers!

DRSS


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SteveM
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Reged: 20/08/04
Posts: 33
Loc: Alberta, CAN
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: DUGABOY1]
      #23501 - 05/01/05 05:41 AM

Dubaboy1

Where can I get the videos you mentioned. I did a quick search on Google and didn't have any luck.

SteveM


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cr500
.300 member


Reged: 11/10/03
Posts: 213
Loc: Singleton ,Australia
Re: Death by Double rifle [Re: SteveM]
      #23513 - 05/01/05 10:32 AM

www.outdoorvisions.com

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