Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact
NitroExpress.com: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it?

View recent messages : 24 hours | 48 hours | 7 days | 14 days | 30 days | 60 days | More Smilies


*** Enjoy NitroExpress.com? Participate and join in. ***
You are not logged in. [Login] Main Index · Search · Active Topics
New user · Who's Online · FAQ · Calendar

Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles
Previous topic Previous   View all topics Index   Next topic Next   Threaded Mode Threaded  

Pages: 1 | 2 | >> (show all)
NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39247
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
The Paradox - is there a modern place for it?
      #18436 - 25/08/04 11:09 PM

The Paradox is said to be making a comeback.

Is there a place for it in the 21st Century?



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
bonanza
.400 member


Reged: 17/05/04
Posts: 2335
Loc: South Carolina
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #18437 - 26/08/04 01:42 AM

what is a paradox?

--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
unspellable
.300 member


Reged: 06/03/04
Posts: 187
Loc: Iowa
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: bonanza]
      #18440 - 26/08/04 03:38 AM

A Paradox is a choke rifled gun made by Holland & Holland. Other makers made them under various names, but today, the tendency is to refer to them all collectively as Paradox guns much as we tend to call all facial tissues a Kleenex. They can be a single or double barrel, but nearly all the ones I've known about were doubles.

The concept is to make a gauge sized barrel that is rifled in the last few inches where a shot gun would have its choke. hence the term "choke rifled". If a gauge sized rifle cartridge (Not a shotgun slug load, the gauge sized rifle cartridge is a rifle cartridge in every sense of the term.) is fired, the choke rifling imparts spin to the bullet as in a conventional rifle. If loaded with a shot cartridge the main part of the barrel is smooth bored and does not disturb the shot charge. The last few inches of rifling impart a relatively small disturbance to the shot charge so the pattern is decent. The idea is to have one gun that can be used as either a rifle or shot gun.

Of course some compromises have to be made and such guns tend to be more rifle than shotgun. One compromise is the stock, as a rifle wants more drop than a shotgun. You have the same compromise with a gun with two sets of barrels, one for a rile, the other for shot. Others peculiar to the rifled choke gun is that you are stuck with a fairly open shot pattern and the barrels are a bit heavy for a shotgun.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
mickey
.416 member


Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: bonanza]
      #18441 - 26/08/04 03:44 AM

A paradox is a rifle that has had the rifling bored out to within about 3-4 inches of the bore. It will usually shoot a shot charge at cylinder bore or abit tighter and shoot a large lead bullet with acceptable accuracy to 100 yards.

I think they are wonderful and I have two of them, oine being a 20 Bore Westley Faunetta. Great for Skeet. Also a beaut of a Chukar/Deer/Coyote rifle.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Peterb
.333 member


Reged: 07/07/04
Posts: 288
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: bonanza]
      #18442 - 26/08/04 04:10 AM

John Kerry is a paradox, and there is no place for him in the 21st Century other than snuggled up at Teddy Kennedy's feet.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
500grains
.416 member


Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #18444 - 26/08/04 05:13 AM

Paradox guns were not too effective when they were used in the old days, and today they will be nothing more than a novelty. But a 4 bore is a novelty too, yet there are still a few 4 bores made these days.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3482
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: 500grains]
      #18460 - 26/08/04 01:29 PM

In the Northern Territory, centre-fire rifles are banned from the public hunting reserves during the waterfowl season, usually four months mid-August to mid-December. This happens to be most of the dry season, and the best time for hunting boars on these reserves. A Paradox gun is perfectly legal for boar year-round, and for geese and ducks during the season. Hence, it is probably the PERFECT gun for the 21st Century in my backyard!

As for "..not too effective", many seasoned hunters including Samuel Baker strongly recommended the inclusion of a Paradox gun in the ideal battery for India/Ceylon and the colonies.

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
500grains
.416 member


Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: Marrakai]
      #18463 - 26/08/04 03:43 PM

Samuel Baker hunted before the advent of effective dangerous game calibers (i.e., 450 nitro express and later). Of course if you merely want to shoot pigs, it should work ok.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3482
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: 500grains]
      #18466 - 26/08/04 08:09 PM

You crack me up, 500grains! Samuel Baker did not 'merely shoot pigs' with his, either!

Permit me to quote Graeme Wright, who relates the experiences of many of us who HAVE hunted after the advent of 'effective' calibres (with your kind indulgence, of course):

"In Australia, paradox guns are regularly used and show just how powerful and effective they can be. Using solids these guns are capable of taking buffalo. Typically, at ranges of about 30 yards, a side shot at a buffalo's chest will give complete penetration with the projectile found against the hide on the other side."


--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39247
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: Marrakai]
      #18472 - 26/08/04 11:58 PM

Marrakai

So would these 'paradoxes' be using normal 'slug' or 'brennecke' type loads or special loads.

As I understand it the original paradoxes were often rifled only in the muzzle end of one barrel, the other being smoothbore. Or were both barrels usually part rifled?

Did they produce consistent patterns with shot? Or did the rifling cause inconsistent patterns and fliers?

Thanks in advance.



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Chasseur
.375 member


Reged: 18/11/03
Posts: 771
Loc: Hunting classic Indian game!
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #18473 - 27/08/04 12:19 AM

Yeah, I am not too sure about the 'not too effective' comment either, they were pretty popular arround 1900 used by many of the great hunters.

I would think they'd be great in shotgun only areas for deer hunting here in the states. Good to go for anyhing, though if they got popular it wouldn't be long before they were regulated and not allowed in shotgun only areas.



--------------------
In regards to action he should devote himself to hunting...
-Machiavelli



Edited by Chasseur (27/08/04 12:22 AM)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
unspellable
.300 member


Reged: 06/03/04
Posts: 187
Loc: Iowa
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #18474 - 27/08/04 12:35 AM

I've never heard of a gun with smooth bore in one barrel and a rifled choke in the other. If it's a SxS with a gauge sized smooth bore on one side and a caliber sized fully rifled barrel on the other, it's a cape gun.

The Paradox type guns were intended to use a brass case loaded with a true bullet sized to match the bore rather than a slug. In other words a gauge sized rifle cartridge. Not a shotgun cartridge loaded with a slug. Modern shotgun cartridges loaded with a slug will have an undersized slug to avoid trouble going through a choke. A 12 gauge slug load will typically have a 14 gauge sized slug. There are modern slug guns with a rifled choke and intened to take a shotgun cartridge loaded with a slug.

Where I'm at a gauge sized rifle or gauge sized rifled choke gun would be legal for deer while a regular centerfire rifle is not. (Never understood why. Never found any deer up in the tree tops. But I can legally hunt rabbits and squirrels with my 375 H&H.)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
mickey
.416 member


Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: Marrakai]
      #18482 - 27/08/04 04:49 AM

Marrakai

You must forgive 500grains ingnorance on anything that is not a Searcy or is older than he is.


My Faunetta shoots a 415 grain jacketed bullet at 1475 pps, the same as a 45-70. My 10 Bore Holland Paradox shoots an 870 grain bullet at 1425 fps and will penitrate a Buffalo end to end.

Anybody who has ever read anything about hunting in India will remember the high praise they recieved for everything up to and including Tigers.



10 bore, 12 bore and 20 Bore. note they came in both brass and paper cases. You must check to see which one yur rifle uses.



20 Bore Faunetta. 6.5 lbs





10 bore Paradox.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

Edited by mickey (27/08/04 04:59 AM)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Peterb
.333 member


Reged: 07/07/04
Posts: 288
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: mickey]
      #18485 - 27/08/04 07:11 AM

It is REALLY hard to add gold to a gun and improve its looks, but that 10 Bore could follow me home any day.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3482
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #18490 - 27/08/04 10:40 AM

NitroX:
Rifles chokes in both barrels, regulated like a double rifle.

Here's a pic of the projectiles from my mold:






Here's the original patent drawing for the rifled choke:






Geez Mickey, that 10-bore is a beauty. Usually only see pictures like that in books....



--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
500grains
.416 member


Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: mickey]
      #18492 - 27/08/04 11:55 AM

"In Australia, paradox guns are regularly used and show just how powerful and effective they can be. Using solids these guns are capable of taking buffalo. Typically, at ranges of about 30 yards, a side shot at a buffalo's chest will give complete penetration with the projectile found against the hide on the other side."

Woweee! It actually penetrated to the hide on the opposite side. Heck, that is almost as good as a 45-70. But we can't expect any more since it is just a shotgun slug.

So why haven't any paradox guns been made for over 100 years? Because they were very ineffective compared to the modern (450 NE and later) DG rounds. If you read some of the older works on DG hunting in AFrica, you will read of the ineffectiveness of paradox guns, particularly on elephant, but on other stuff too.

Does anyone know how many professional hunters in Africa use paradox guns to back up their clients?

For some reason there is a mentality that thinks old stuff is better just because it is old. I think old stuff is better if it performs better. If it perfoms worse than more modern stuff, then it is worse.

So I guess Mickey drives a Model T Ford because old stuff is better. Perhaps he can show us either a photo of a recovered bullet or the wound channel (or at least exit hole) from the 10 bore slug that penetrated a buffalo end to end. I would be interested in those photos - not saying it didn't happen, just asking for more detail.

Waiting for a photo...

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
seroadglide
.275 member


Reged: 06/05/04
Posts: 52
Loc: West Tenn., USA
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: Marrakai]
      #18495 - 27/08/04 12:11 PM

I have read of these Paradox guns in old digests, etc.

I was wondering about the loaded shell you picture with one of your bullets beside it.
-By what mechanical means does the die produce such a consistent, deep crimp?

-I can make out what appears to be lubricant. Is it wax or another, more "modern" type lubricant?

Interesting thread and fine guns too.

Douglas R. Mays

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
AdamTayler
.375 member


Reged: 22/03/04
Posts: 688
Loc: B.C.
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: mickey]
      #18505 - 27/08/04 04:28 PM

Can you buy solid brass casings and reload? Beautiful firearm, the scroll work reminds me of Ukrainian Easter eggs.

--------------------
It's the journey, not the destination.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
ALAN_MCKENZIE
.400 member


Reged: 24/03/04
Posts: 1214
Loc: Western Australia
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: 500grains]
      #18516 - 27/08/04 11:00 PM

Well 500grains you have the bull by the horns or maybe the balls again.
Rifled shotguns are still being manufactured today in various configurations including :-single barrels,doubles,pumps,auto's and bolt action single barrels.
I own a paradox and use it regularly and I'm always on the lookout for another to add to my collection of using firearms.

--------------------
"Dogs always bark at their master"
Sir Seretse Khama.25th June 1949

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
ALAN_MCKENZIE
.400 member


Reged: 24/03/04
Posts: 1214
Loc: Western Australia
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: 500grains]
      #18518 - 27/08/04 11:07 PM

I might also add that there are more cartridges loaded with solid slugs on the market now than any time I can remember in the last 40 years.
Doesent that tell you something 500 grns............

--------------------
"Dogs always bark at their master"
Sir Seretse Khama.25th June 1949

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
500grains
.416 member


Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: ALAN_MCKENZIE]
      #18524 - 28/08/04 12:51 AM

Gosh Alan, I guess you got me. As I said, paradox guns are pretty good for pigs. So are shotgun slugs. But not for the big stuff like elephant, hippo, rhino and cape buffalo.

How many elephant have you shot with your rifled shotguns?

Any pics?

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Photog
.224 member


Reged: 30/03/04
Posts: 15
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: 500grains]
      #18529 - 28/08/04 05:57 AM

Gosh 500grains,
Who was talking about elephant, hippo, rhino, etc. Or is that all you hunt?
I think the question was "is there a modern place for it", is there alot of rhino hunting going on? I think most of us would love to bag the "Big Five" but how many of us will get to.
I think most of us hunt a little closer to home every year rather than the once in a lifetime hunt. In the U.S. that means Deer, Elk, Moose, Hog, Bear. Deer being the most common prey, and in states like Ohio, Iowa, Wisconsin, Southern Michigan, you have to use a shotgun. I would love a Paradox, or a 12 bore rifle, either would be perfect for my needs.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
mickey
.416 member


Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: Photog]
      #18548 - 28/08/04 11:22 AM

In reply to:

Poster: 500grains
Subject: Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it?

Gosh Alan, I guess you got me. As I said, paradox guns are pretty good for pigs. So are shotgun slugs. But not for the big stuff like elephant, hippo, rhino and cape buffalo.

How many elephant have you shot with your rifled shotguns?

Any pics?




5oograins

We all know that a Paradox is not for Pachyderms, neither is a .22LR or a 30-06. Would you say they have no modern place left? A Paradox gives the hunter an option of a shotgun or a rifle in one weapon. Not many Quail are shot with a 300RUM and not many Elk are shot with a 12 Gauge. With a Paradox you can do both, with alternating shots from the same weapon. That is why it is a Paradox.



--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

Edited by mickey (28/08/04 11:23 AM)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39247
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: mickey]
      #18551 - 28/08/04 12:35 PM

To anyone - would there be a problem shooting shot through the rifling and then a bullet? Can shot damage rifling?



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
mickey
.416 member


Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #18562 - 28/08/04 02:21 PM

Nitro

Lead shot does not hurt. It shoots like an improved cylinder bore.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39247
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: mickey]
      #18564 - 28/08/04 02:25 PM

A couple of Holland & Holland Paradox's

A 16 bore





And a 12-bore







--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
ALAN_MCKENZIE
.400 member


Reged: 24/03/04
Posts: 1214
Loc: Western Australia
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: 500grains]
      #18569 - 28/08/04 11:03 PM

Well golly gosh 500grns,as I recall the last elephant I shot was quiet a few years ago however I remember it very vividly.
It went something like this:-
We set up an ambush and included a heap of claymores in the surprise package.
Within minutes of clearing the no go area all hell broke loose.
A belt of 50 cal BMG later the dust settled.
On inspection a very large and very dead elephant was found.
Yes I've shot an elephant,not with a parodox and no I dont have a photo of it to remind me of what I did to that poor bastard of an elephant.
I've also hunted the most dangerous animal in the world and survived to tell about it...

The PARODOX,is there a modern place for it?????
" YES"


--------------------
"Dogs always bark at their master"
Sir Seretse Khama.25th June 1949

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
seroadglide
.275 member


Reged: 06/05/04
Posts: 52
Loc: West Tenn., USA
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #18599 - 29/08/04 05:24 PM

NitroX,
Thanks for the photos that include the accesories. I understand the nice crimp.

When casting for such a gun, does one use an alloy or pure lead?

Douglas R. Mays

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Gadge
.300 member


Reged: 02/05/04
Posts: 130
Loc: Gippsland, Victoria, Australia
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: ALAN_MCKENZIE]
      #18614 - 29/08/04 09:42 PM

Well, just to stir the pot: came across one that's coming up for auction in NSW soon [couple of weeks]. What looks to be a very nice Army & Navy 12 bore, cased, but looks like no mould. Auctioneeers estimate AU$4.5-5k plus etceteras.

It's with Aust. Antique Arms Auctions; you can download the catalogue here PDF, ca 1.2 Mb; this link will work, unlike that from their webpage.
Lot 320, p. 19; pic is top of p.14.

--------------------
Cheers,
Doug

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
chrispie
.275 member


Reged: 30/01/04
Posts: 67
Loc: New England, USA
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: Gadge]
      #18626 - 30/08/04 12:58 AM

nice gun, also look at lot#322 the 500 holland hammer gun, to bad i won't be their. cause i'd through in a bid

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3482
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: 500grains]
      #18672 - 31/08/04 12:39 AM

500grains said:
"But not for the big stuff like elephant, hippo, rhino and cape buffalo."

..so, is it worth attempting a further contribution to his meagre education?
The 10-bore Paradoxes WERE specifically designed and marketed by Holland & Holland for use against pachyderms!







500grains also said:
"Paradox guns were not too effective when they were used in the old days..."
"If you read some of the older works on DG hunting in AFrica, you will read of the ineffectiveness of paradox guns..."

Care to enlighten us with a few references, 500brains?


Meanwhile, here's one of my favourites: an observation by R.C.F. Maugham, His Majesty's Consul-General at Beira, Portugese East Africa (and inveterate big game hunter), writing just after the turn of the century.

"....no hunter in his right senses should place his blind trust in such a weapon as even the .450 cordite rifle to extricate him from the thousand and one dangers by which he is liable from day to day to be confronted in Africa. I therefore unhesitatingly advocate, in addition to the most perfected type of modern high-velocity weapon which we are ever likely to see, the inclusion of a sound, heavy rifle intended for use at close range, the shock of whose bullet, even if it should not instantly kill, will assuredly be sufficiently great to disable or turn a charging beast. For those who do not possess the strength to use a heavy eight-bore, which I look upon as the ideal weapon par excellance for this purpose, I would suggest the adoption of a 10 or at least of a 12-bore Paradox throwing a 1 3/4 ounce bullet, driven by a charge of five drams of black powder. This, in capable hands, should be sufficiently powerful to produce the desired stopping effect."




--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
vigillinus
.300 member


Reged: 11/12/03
Posts: 115
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: mickey]
      #19093 - 09/09/04 12:47 PM

Good many decades back I had a 20 guage Evans sidelock Paradox, plain finish no engraving at all but Best Quality, obviously made for a crank, it was cased about mint, and we tried our darndest but Dick Vogt and I never could get a load that would shoot decently. We probably gave up too early.

As to a 20 guage Westley Richards Fauneta, I would consider that a super desirable item.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
470Rigby
.333 member


Reged: 23/02/04
Posts: 328
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #19604 - 04/10/04 04:31 PM

There has been very little published on Paradox's, but that is about to change with the forthcoming publication of the 5th Volume in Wal Winfer's series on "British Single Shot Rifle", which devoted to Holland and Holland rifles.

During his research on that firm, Wal has unearthed a wealth of hitherto unknown material on Paradox's, and has included it in the new book.

Afficionados should get their order in now!

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
seroadglide
.275 member


Reged: 06/05/04
Posts: 52
Loc: West Tenn., USA
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: NitroX]
      #19735 - 13/10/04 01:04 PM

The Autumn 2004 The Double Gun Journal has an article titled "An Unmatched Pair". It is by Ross Seyfried. One of the pair is a 20 bore Fauneta.

I would be very happy to have a hunting arm like either of the ones in the above mentioned article. The Fauneta would especially be nice as we have feral hogs here in Tennessee (not my part though). We also have plenty of birds, squirrels, etc. that could be dispatched with shot.

Douglas Mays

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Honey_badger
.275 member


Reged: 03/01/03
Posts: 50
Loc: UK
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: seroadglide]
      #19784 - 16/10/04 02:09 AM

My understanding was that Paradoxes and the like were mainly designed for use on cats. However, I had not seen that advertisment for the 10 bore! They were still being used well into the 1960s. John Kingsley-Heath had one made by Purdey.

This is just an educated guess, but part of the reason that they went out of use may be down to British firearms law. Here, there is one licence for a shotgun and another for a 'firearm' (rifles and pistols, until the latter were banned). As a paradox is a bit of both, this may have caused much scratching of official heads when the British laws began to become more restrictive in the 1960s. For the same reason, drillings are uncommon here.

I do have a 12 bore paradox round in my colection and it is huge!

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39247
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: The Paradox - is there a modern place for it? [Re: Honey_badger]
      #20444 - 04/11/04 01:09 PM

Here is an interesting Paradox I saw elsewhere on the net. It is a Paradox Drilling in 12 bore/12 bore/9.3x70mm.

I hae featured it on the Single Shot and Combination rifle forum on NE.com

Drilling Paradox



--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Pages: 1 | 2 | >> (show all)


Previous topic Previous   View all topics Index   Next topic Next   Threaded Mode Threaded  

Extra information
1 registered and 79 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:  CptCurl 

Print Topic

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled

Rating:
Topic views: 7155

Rate this topic

Jump to

Contact Us NitroExpress.com

Powered by UBB.threads™ 6.5.5


Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact


Copyright 2003 to 2011 - all rights reserved