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Shooting & Reloading - Mausers, Big Bores and others >> Big Bore Rifles

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ovny
.375 member


Reged: 19/06/08
Posts: 591
Loc: Spain
Madness
      #107934 - 23/06/08 08:16 AM

Hello friends, I have titled this thread of discussion as "madness" because it somehow is. As you've read I have a 550 Magnum rifle Ceska in 375 H & H caliber Magnum, but I like the large sizes. On the other hand, I will never hunt in Africa, my budget and I may not believe that I never allow it, barely dipper in my country. And that is what will be a "folly", because even a few years I have decided to buy a rifle Ceska equal to that but I have a higher caliber, and the issue is between 416 and 458 Rem Magnum Winchester Magnum. As I have said is a whim, a pure pleasure to shoot with a large caliber (I like the 416 Rigby but that ammunition is more expensive than those that I mentioned earlier). Between 416 and RM 458 WM what big difference?, Setback, energy of impact, speed and price of ammunition, or what is happening you, your expert opinion is for me a great reference. On the other hand, I accept criticism of my "madness".

Gratitude,

Oscar.

I am Spanish

--------------------
I am Spanish


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Con
.333 member


Reged: 24/05/04
Posts: 261
Loc: Victoria
Re: Madness [Re: ovny]
      #107949 - 23/06/08 03:10 PM

Madness my arse ... you sound perfectly normal Oscar. I'd consider the 458WinMag as I believe it's the cheapest bigbore to run. If your after a CZ, I think they also make a 416Rem which would also be a consideration as you can use your H&H brass to make the 416's. Projectiles cost more though in 416cal than in 458cal.
My only concern with a CZ 458WM is that they can be prone to not feeding well ... typical factory rifle issues that can be rectified by a good gunsmith.
Cheers...
Con


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tinker
.416 member


Reged: 12/03/05
Posts: 4835
Loc: Nevada
Re: Madness [Re: Con]
      #107951 - 23/06/08 03:21 PM

Oscar-

Welcome to the site.
You're not mad at all.
Big bore rifles bring great joy to sane and healthy men around the world.
I enjoy them too!

If your interest is simply to have a big bore rifle in the 416-458 range, I recommend the 458WM.
As noted by Con, it's an easy and affordable rifle to shoot.
There is a very large and diverse selection of bullets in .458 diameter, and a bolt rifle chambered in .458 is a very versatile rifle.

I have a very nice, flat shooting 350 grain bullet load that runs at 2450fps with no troubles at all, and I can load it down with much lighter bullets or load it to it's dangerous game potential with 500gr bullets at over 2100fps.

The 416 is a great round, but there are only a few bullet choices, and they are expensive.

Enjoy your big bore rifles!


--Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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Tatume
.400 member


Reged: 09/06/07
Posts: 1091
Loc: Gloucester, Va USA
Re: Madness [Re: tinker]
      #107954 - 23/06/08 08:47 PM

Hello Oscar,

The 458 Winchester Magnum is as the others have said it is, relatively inexpensive to shoot. The excellent Hornady 500 gr soft and solid bullets are not too expensive, and are excellent dangerous-game bullets. On the other hand, cast bullets intended for the 45-70 work perfectly in the 458 WM, and for the price of a mold you can have an unlimited supply. I like the RCBS 405 gr mold. It is a gas-check design, but the bullets work just fine without the gas check. Then there are the excellent 300 and 405 gr Remington bulk bullets, which are available at reasonable cost here in the States. I don’t know what the overseas situation is.

My favorite practice load uses military surplus IMR-4895 powder, which I realize you probably can’t get. But, there are many good powders for this cartridge. IMR-3031 is a very good powder for the 458 WM.

Good luck with your big-bore rifle. I certainly enjoy mine.

Take care, Tom


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bigmaxx
.375 member


Reged: 13/06/07
Posts: 660
Loc: Bowling Green KY U.S.A.
Re: Madness [Re: Tatume]
      #107958 - 23/06/08 11:25 PM

What loads do you use with the 405 grain remington JSP's in .458 lott?

--------------------
One day at a time...


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Schamankungulo
.300 member


Reged: 21/04/07
Posts: 115
Loc: Southeastern USA
Re: Madness [Re: bigmaxx]
      #107962 - 24/06/08 12:50 AM

bigmaxx look over in the reloading for doubles , singles and NE's , you asked that one a while back and me and someone else responded to it ..

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ovny
.375 member


Reged: 19/06/08
Posts: 591
Loc: Spain
Re: Madness [Re: bigmaxx]
      #107963 - 24/06/08 12:54 AM

Thank you friends, I have decided that once last year I said I will buy a 458 WM caliber in the Ceska , as long as the weapon continues at an affordable price (around 1000 euros, which I do not know to what amounts in dollars) . I know that is a whim and who do not need, but as I say, is my only hobby these large weapons and cartridges I love. Thank you for everything.

Greetings,

Oscar.

--------------------
I am Spanish


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Tatume
.400 member


Reged: 09/06/07
Posts: 1091
Loc: Gloucester, Va USA
Re: Madness [Re: ovny]
      #107970 - 24/06/08 02:58 AM

Quote:

What loads do you use with the 405 grain Remington JSPs in .458 Lott?




Sorry, but I don't have any data for 458 Lott; my gun is a 458 Win Mag. On consulting the Hornady manual, I find that for some powders and 500 gr bullets (my favorites among them) they recommend lower starting loads and lower maximum loads for the 458 Lott than they do for the 458 Win Mag. Based on that observation, I would be cautious about substituting 458 Win Mag data in the Lott cartridge.

Take care, Tom


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Oz
.224 member


Reged: 24/05/08
Posts: 39
Loc: Australia
Re: Madness [Re: Tatume]
      #108011 - 24/06/08 01:34 PM

Quote:

Hello Oscar,

On the other hand, cast bullets intended for the 45-70 work perfectly in the 458 WM, and for the price of a mold you can have an unlimited supply. I like the RCBS 405 gr mold. It is a gas-check design, but the bullets work just fine without the gas check.

Take care, Tom




I second that, I've just started shooting paper-patched lead, slightly harder (1 in 20) and pushing them faster asthere's no lead to bore contact. When it comes to plinking with a small artilery shell you just can't beat the .458WinMag

As for feed problems it's a bit of trial and error with polishing the feed path and projectile selection. i use Woodliegh's but they're 'local' and a bit easier to get for us.
Cheers
Oz

--------------------
Once upon a time, long long ago
there was a contented young woman
happy with the choices made by her husband

But it was only the once,
and it was a long long time ago


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ovny
.375 member


Reged: 19/06/08
Posts: 591
Loc: Spain
Re: Madness [Re: Oz]
      #108062 - 25/06/08 02:09 AM

Hello Oz,

I certainly buy a 458WM weapon in , but once they have passed the time I said. Is that not long ago I bought a gun and I think it's better to let the waters calm ejjejeje.

Thank you for your response,

Oscar.

--------------------
I am Spanish


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bigmaxx
.375 member


Reged: 13/06/07
Posts: 660
Loc: Bowling Green KY U.S.A.
Re: Madness [Re: ovny]
      #108073 - 25/06/08 04:57 AM

If you go ahead and get the rifle chambered in .458 lott you will be able to shoot the .458 winchester mag as well. When I bought my Ruger M77 .458 lott I had no plans on actually taking it to Africa either. Its going with me the first 10 days of September to the Zambezi Valley for buffalo! God is good.

--------------------
One day at a time...


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Tatume
.400 member


Reged: 09/06/07
Posts: 1091
Loc: Gloucester, Va USA
Re: Madness [Re: bigmaxx]
      #108078 - 25/06/08 06:57 AM

This is going to start trouble, which is not my intent. But, when making the decision between the 458 Win Mag and the 458 Lott, keep in mind that some of us consider the Win Mag to be the superior cartridge.

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ovny
.375 member


Reged: 19/06/08
Posts: 591
Loc: Spain
Re: Madness [Re: Tatume]
      #108079 - 25/06/08 07:05 AM

Bigmaxxx, I really accordance with 458 Win Mag, I think that is good and stuck his setback think that is already beginning to be felt. I also take into account the price of ammunition, because I want to take the rifle, I will not be able to go to Africa to hunt, but I like guns and I love these gauges so powerful, so with 458 WM I left .

Thank you,

Oscar.

--------------------
I am Spanish


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mehulkamdar
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 3688
Loc: State of Ill-Annoy USA.
Re: Madness [Re: ovny]
      #108332 - 28/06/08 01:54 AM

Oscar,

Since I like comparing beautiful rifles to beautiful women, let me assure that no one needs to have Penelope Cruz as his girlfriend but everyone who is normal wants her.

You are perfectly normal and so are your interests. May you have many fine rifles in your gunsafe!

--------------------
The Ark was made by amateurs. Experts built the Titanic.

Mehul Kamdar


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ovny
.375 member


Reged: 19/06/08
Posts: 591
Loc: Spain
Re: Madness [Re: mehulkamdar]
      #108337 - 28/06/08 03:10 AM

You're right Mehul Kamdar , but a rifle was never going to hurt you jejeej and is cheaper to maintain. Certainly I do not mind having a girlfriend Penelope Cruz. Jejejeje. Finally, I suggested buying a Ceska in the 458 caliber Win Mag and I assure you that I will do, but then my wife gets angry with me. It will only be for a few days jejeej.

--------------------
I am Spanish


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