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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Paradox and Bore Guns

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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
10 bore Holland & Holland Paradox
      #368979 - 05/09/22 04:10 AM

More info to come once I get pictures, in the mean time you can speculate.
I will say that the date 1898 is involved
- Mike



--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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93x64mm
.416 member


Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 3954
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: 3DogMike]
      #368982 - 05/09/22 05:57 AM

Now that is impressive & so is the casting!
Very nice acquisition their Mike!
This I believe may be a very Paradoxical photo.....no rifle.
Am I close?


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tinkerModerator
.416 member


Reged: 12/03/05
Posts: 4835
Loc: Nevada
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: 93x64mm]
      #368985 - 05/09/22 08:51 AM

You have my attention!

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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CptCurlAdministrator
.450 member


Reged: 01/05/04
Posts: 5268
Loc: Fincastle, Botetourt County, V...
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: tinker]
      #368993 - 05/09/22 08:45 PM

Hey Mike,

I'm suited up to play this game.









Congratulations! And keep us informed of all developments.

Curl

--------------------
RoscoeStephenson.com

YOUR DOUBLE RIFLE IS YOUR BEST FRIEND.



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rigbymauser
.400 member


Reged: 15/05/05
Posts: 1970
Loc: Denmark
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: CptCurl]
      #368996 - 05/09/22 11:29 PM

oh man...

You have bought a 10bore paradox....


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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: rigbymauser]
      #369002 - 06/09/22 07:21 AM

You guys were spot on…...
Holland & Holland hammerless 10 bore Paradox from 1898
8 Dram equivalent 2 7/8" case, Nitro Proof, 27" barrels, and 13lbs 4oz





More pictures to come (slowly)
- Mike


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tinkerModerator
.416 member


Reged: 12/03/05
Posts: 4835
Loc: Nevada
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: 3DogMike]
      #369003 - 06/09/22 07:43 AM

Very nice!

I can't wait for a field report


Imgur - not anything I'd recommend to anyone
I'm still using Flickr, it continues to do the trick without drama or hassle

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: tinker]
      #369004 - 06/09/22 08:29 AM






--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: 3DogMike]
      #369005 - 06/09/22 08:31 AM



the ratchet rifling is impressive, and still sharp enough to trim a finger nail


--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: 3DogMike]
      #369006 - 06/09/22 08:48 AM

Interesting: only 89 of the 10 bore Paradox were made by H&H, of those only 37 were hammerless like this one.

Like Roscoe's screenshot, I will be using Track of the Wolf thin case brass, and a proper 875 grain Fosbery Paradox bullet sized .806" and cast of 1-20. Initial loads will be 220 grains (8 Drams) of Swiss 1 1/2.
I expect the recoil and smoke will be about on par with my 15 1/2 lb 8 bore G.E. Lewis?

I'm waiting for a push thru bullet sizer made by my friend Steve Bertram to get the bullets down to size, the original H&H mould (not numbered to the gun) casts a bit oversize and slightly out of round.
As this one was Nitro Proof I will eventually try Cal Pappas' recommended smokeless loads using his Blue Dot recipe.

I will have to do a "family group photo" of my bore rifles 12, 10, and 8
Sorry but a 4 bore remains out of my reach unless I score a big lottery win……..

- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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prairie_ghost
.300 member


Reged: 19/07/08
Posts: 129
Loc: casper, wy
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: 3DogMike]
      #369007 - 06/09/22 11:35 AM

Lovely gun, lovlier engraving!

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Huvius
.416 member


Reged: 04/11/07
Posts: 3517
Loc: Colorado
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: prairie_ghost]
      #369009 - 06/09/22 11:47 AM

WOW!!
That would be the pride o' the farm around these parts...

--------------------
He who lives in the past is doomed to enjoy it.


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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: Huvius]
      #369010 - 06/09/22 01:46 PM

Holland and Holland ledger notes for this gun:

The buyer "Pudokota" is likely the Raja of Pudukkottai 1875-1928, which princely state is in the Tamil area South SouthWest of Madras.




--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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93x64mm
.416 member


Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 3954
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: 3DogMike]
      #369014 - 06/09/22 09:13 PM

This is as best my eyes can read those notes!

Shot & regulated with 8 Drams # (of) powder
Solid cone bullets hard 1 in 15
Unswed$ed 2 7/8 case
50 yards

1Dram = 27.34gn powder
8Dram = 218.75gn powder = LOTS of smoke & flames!
Not sure on the weight of bullet, but it will be a corker for sure!

One hell of a lot of jealous guys here Mike, you'll definitely have a smile that won't come off for a week when you let those cotton reels fly!

Edited by 93x64mm (07/09/22 06:08 AM)


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lancaster
.470 member


Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8664
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: 93x64mm]
      #369029 - 07/09/22 02:19 PM

take a look at the brass https://www.trackofthewolf.com/List/Item.aspx/1210/9

is this drawn brass ot lathe turned?

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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3DogMike
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Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: Holland & Holland 10 bore Paradox [Re: lancaster]
      #369041 - 08/09/22 01:57 AM

Quote:

take a look at the brass https://www.trackofthewolf.com/List/Item.aspx/1210/9
is this drawn brass ot lathe turned?




I believe the 10ga is lathe turned. I have some of the Track of the Wolf 12 bore brass and it is certainly lathe turned.

Will have it in my hands by the end of this week and can report for sure.
- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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DarylS
.700 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26413
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: 3DogMike]
      #369042 - 08/09/22 02:21 AM

NICE, Mike.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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lancaster
.470 member


Reged: 06/05/08
Posts: 8664
Loc: There's a lighthouse in the mi...
Re: Teaser picture for change of scenery [Re: DarylS]
      #369043 - 08/09/22 03:53 AM

thanks, it looks interesting because of the headstamp

--------------------
Norwegian hunter misses moose, shoots man on toilet
.
bringing civilisation to the barbarians


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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
H&H 10 bore update: [Re: lancaster]
      #369205 - 12/09/22 02:04 PM

1st off: lancaster….got my order & the Track of the Wolf 10ga cases are for certain lathe turned. Great fit in my gun.

2 of the Track the Wolf and 2 older 10bore brass cases I had stashed, loaded with bullets from the H&H mould I got with the gun.
8 Drams of Swiss 1 1/2 and appropriate nitro card and lubed fibre wads under roughly sized down bullets and I have 4 rounds to test when I get time in the next couple of days. No proper crimper yet so will be fired one a a time.
……sorry; no buffalo, Gaur, elephant or tigers here to test them on…..

- Mike



--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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93x64mm
.416 member


Reged: 07/12/11
Posts: 3954
Loc: Nth QLD Australia
Re: H&H 10 bore update: [Re: 3DogMike]
      #369209 - 12/09/22 09:03 PM

Mike,
Buckstix makes a crimper of sorts for brass cases - might be beneficial
http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat....true#Post363687


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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: H&H 10 bore update: [Re: 93x64mm]
      #369213 - 13/09/22 01:29 AM

Quote:

Mike,
Buckstix makes a crimper of sorts for brass cases - might be beneficial
http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat....true#Post363687




Right you are! I have already contacted Buck and need to send a couple of cases and bullets out to him for making sure of proper fit.
- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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georgegibbs505
.275 member


Reged: 19/01/07
Posts: 75
Loc: WV
Re: H&H 10 bore update: [Re: 3DogMike]
      #369228 - 13/09/22 10:52 AM

Mike, very nice Holland, should be a fun one to play with. If your lucky, you don’t need to win the lottery to get a 4 bore. Looking forward to seeing the bore rifle family photo.

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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: H&H 10 bore update: [Re: georgegibbs505]
      #369229 - 13/09/22 12:09 PM

Quote:

Mike, very nice Holland, should be a fun one to play with. If your lucky, you don’t need to win the lottery to get a 4 bore. Looking forward to seeing the bore rifle family photo.



I shall get a "family photo" of the heavy 12, 10, and 8 up in the next couple of days.

As to a 4 bore: it would certainly round out the "family", though I would not really have a huge urge to have a 4 bore with the intent to do much recreational shooting. Years ago I got to shoot a Bland single 4 bore owned by Ray Meyer (I heard that it went to Alaska after Ray's passing)…….I felt it actually was not that much more "invigorating" than an 8 bore to shoot from a standing position on my own two hind legs.
Just that a proper 4 bore weighs about like a truck axle…….tho much better looking.
- Mike

--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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rigbymauser
.400 member


Reged: 15/05/05
Posts: 1970
Loc: Denmark
Re: H&H 10 bore update: [Re: 3DogMike]
      #369231 - 13/09/22 06:34 PM

Hey Mike.

The swiss 1.5F is very good if not the best. My Manton takes almost 10drams and it burns clean too.


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3DogMike
.400 member


Reged: 29/01/15
Posts: 1404
Loc: Western Slope, Colorado USA
Re: H&H 10 bore update: [Re: rigbymauser]
      #369415 - 21/09/22 07:34 AM

Finally got out to shoot, only loaded 4 for initial test.
8 Drams of Swiss 1 1/2, Fed 215 primer, nitro card and SPG lubed fibre wad, overshot card wad under 875 grain Paradox bullet from vintage H&H mould sized to bore diameter.

25 yards today, standing rest, crossing a bit but can work on that. R1/L1 are 1 1/4", better hold for R2/L2 out of dirty barrels were 5/8"
The 2 "smaller" uppermost holes are from a .577BPE…..

I'm a happy camper. Recoil about as expected, close but not quite as much as my 8 bore GE Lewis with 10 Dram & round ball.
- Mike



--------------------
"Here's to killing people you don't like with people you do"

"Will Rogers never met a fighter pilot"
- Anon

“Always carry a flask of whiskey in case of snakebite, and furthermore always carry a small snake."
-- W. C. Fields


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