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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Double Rifles

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Judson
.300 member


Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Building a double rifle
      #39054 - 12/10/05 07:07 AM

I am new to this Forum and it looks to be great! I am a gun smith living up in Maine and started building double rifles a few years ago. My current project is a 450 # 2 N. E. and it is just about done other then the checkering. I regulated it to be about 1.25" apart at 50 yards. If you people would like, and I can figure out how to do it I will post some pictures and describe building this rifle.
This is the rifle before I finished regulating it and rust blued it. The stock is of South African Blackthorn.

--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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mickeyModerator
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Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4639
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39058 - 12/10/05 09:06 AM

Absolutely. I think we would love a blow by blow description. A very nice looking piece of wood also.

One question though, why did you regulate it for 1.25" @ 50 yards? Is that the center to center bore measurement?



--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.


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JPeterson
.275 member


Reged: 08/10/05
Posts: 68
Loc: Wisconsin USA
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: mickey]
      #39060 - 12/10/05 09:18 AM

Thats really cool, lets hear some details.

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MauserRifle
.300 member


Reged: 15/03/05
Posts: 153
Loc: U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39068 - 12/10/05 11:41 AM

Judson

That is a fine looking DR. Please give us all the particulars.

I am curious as to what type of action you used?

--------------------
Mauser Rifle

Everyday is a great day, some days are just better than others!


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Judson
.300 member


Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: MauserRifle]
      #39105 - 13/10/05 08:39 AM

This rifle started out as a French Fusal Robust 16 gauge with pitted bores, no stock and a great price of $60.00.
I bought it years ago when I had just opened my gun smithing business and was doing some repair work for a gunshop in Corena Maine. The owner of the gunshop did not like my quote as to the cost of restocking the gun so I got it for what he had in it. My plan was to turn it into a double rifle but back then I did not know quite how to go about this. I thought about sleeving the barrels and other such measures, which are not the right way to do things. As with so many projects the little 16 ended up in a drawer, not forgotten but on the back burner. Time past, and I read as much as I could find on building double rifles and kept the 16 project in the back of my mind.
Over the years more and more we got into building bigger caliber rifles and a few for people who hunted Africa. Several of these people, very happy with the bolt guns I had built for them, kept pestering me to get into building double rifles. Since I have always loved doubles and finally convinced my wife that this was a good idea the project started.

The Fusal Robust had all the features one looks for when evaluating an action for a double rifle. It had double underlugs, a third fastener, (hidden) one piece mono block and small diameter firing pins which would not require bushing. Where it was a 16 gauge I wanted a low pressure cartridge and after some investigation found that the .450 # 2 Nitro Express is about the lowest pressure cartridge going. (25,000 C.U.P.) By figuring out the head area of the 450 compaired to the 16 ga shell and compairing this to the origional proof loads I found that the 450 would be far pressure then the proof loads so in theory I should be safe. Even with this in mind when I re proofed the gun it was a tence moment!!!! It was proofed with a 500 grain bullet with 18 grains over the max for a 465 grain bullet.

--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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500Nitro
.450 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 7244
Loc: Victoria, Australia
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39107 - 13/10/05 08:47 AM


Judosn,

It's good to see someone doing things the right way as oppsed to
just trying to turn something worth $100 into $10000 without
regard for the consequences - as some so called gun dealers /
gun smiths seem to do in the US.

Well done - I am impressed.

I agree with you re the action - sounds perfect in how it is made
and the size. Should make a nice slim double rifle.

What barrels did you use ?

How did you attached the barrels - by using the exisiting mono bloc
(ie did you sleeve them into the mono block) or completely remake the lumps etc as well ?

500 Nitro


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Judson
.300 member


Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: 500Nitro]
      #39108 - 13/10/05 09:54 AM

Well I was going to edit my last post and add a picture I had to go find, but I guess I will for go that and do another post.

The first thing I did after checking out the action as to it's strength was to strip it down and check it out internally. It had dog tooth tumblers. (This is the British way of saying that the firing pin is part of the hammers.) Since the 450 is very low pressure I elected not to go to bushed firing pins as chances of a blowen primer are not a concern at the 450s pressure. Next I looked at the barrels and found the mono block to be one piece of machined steel. I decided to use the origional mono block and again partly due to the low pressure, and also how thin the front edge of the mono block was to solder the barrels into the mono block as was done in years past instead of threading them. This was a comon practice and if all parts are tined first a good solder joint is almost assured. On the other hand the quarter rib was silver brazed into place this would make sure that nothing moved during the reheating and re soldering requiered during regulating. If this picture comes out it will show the 16 ga. apart and the origional barrels removed from the mono block. I will try to post another picture of the barrels fitted to the mono block on this same post it you will stick with me for a few.

this is after the barrels were fitted to the mono block but they have not yet been soldered into place.

--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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Daryl_S
.577 member


Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 16787
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39124 - 14/10/05 03:04 AM

Wonderful blow-by blow - thankyou very much. I am keenly interested in further posts. I see a side-by-side double rifle in my future, now.

--------------------
Daryl


"a rifle without hammers, is like a Spaniel without ears" Edward VII


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Judson
.300 member


Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Daryl_S]
      #39130 - 14/10/05 09:22 AM

I am getting a bit ahead of my self. Before the barrels can be fitted to the mono block they have to be short chambered. Once they are soldered or threaded and soldered into the mono block the new extractor is made and the final chambering and head spacing is done. Once finished with this three wedges were made for this rifle. On this double I made the wedges slightly larger then the gaps between the barrels. One wedge was installed several inches in front of the forearm,(if all worked out well this would become the sling swivel) The next wedge about half way between the first and the muzzel and the third at the muzzel. These wedges could be driven along the tapper of the barrels to change the point of impact of the bullets during the regulating process. The barrels and wedges were held in place with hose clamps during the regulating and untill finally soldered into place.
Now the fun begins!!! Load up some ammo and get to shooting and regulating. I checked the barrels and set them up to the same point of aim with a bore sighter. Then I recorded this info in my note book. Then it was out to the range behind my shop and fire four shots, two from each barrel. If you do this make sure to mark each shot as to right or left barrel or else things will get confusing very fast! With this rifle the barrels were crossing at 50 yards, which I thought would happen. This would mean that the wedges would have to move to the rear to spread the barrels. I did not move all three though, only the front wedge. A little change in the position of the wedges is a big change of point of impact! I continued this process untill I was happy with the groups. I ended up with 1.25" difference between the left and right barrel at 50 yards, height is the same and I left well enough alone as that is slightly less then the center to center spread of the barrels. I have not tried the rifle at 100 yards but the gap should close and in theory be converging into one group. (All this sounds great on paper, we will see!)


This is during the regulating process and belive me, I am at full recoil, the rifle was on the sand bags! Really the rifle is nice to shoot, just a big push, not a jab. If you notice there is very little muzzel jump as there is very little drop in the stock. Again I am getting a bit ahead of the story since I had to make the stock before I could regulate the rifle but I am comming to that.


--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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Judson
.300 member


Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39184 - 16/10/05 08:39 AM


The process of regulating goes as follows. I fired four shots, two from each barrel. All shots were marked as to which barrel so as to avoid confusion. Then it is back into the shop and I checked the barrels with the bore sighter and recorded this in my note book. Now out comes the tourch and I heat the wedges to the point where I can move them in order to change the point of impact. Driving the front wedge to the rear will spread the point of impact. If the hose clamp on the front wedge is left tight driving the middle wedge to the rear will have the oppisite effect and bring the shots closser togther. Once the adjustments are made the wedges are re soldered and allowed to cool and it is back to the range and try again. Regulating the rifle was a long process, around 50 shots, however I found it to be very enjoyable and chalanging.
By the way, if any of you want to try building your own double rifle there is a very good book on the subject. It is Building Double Rifles on Shotgun Actions written by Mr.W. Ellis Brown. I do some things different then stated in his book but I am not saying he is wrong just that we do some things different. In any case his book is well worth the money and I got a great deal of vital information from it!! Pluss, it is very enjoyable reading.

If this picture comes out it will be of me working on the regulating of the barrels. You get lots of intrest when you take a torch to a rifle in order to get it to hit where you want. Do this at a public range and like Mr. Brown states, no one wants your help in sighting in their rifles!!!!




--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 2681
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39188 - 16/10/05 12:03 PM

Judson:
there have been a few threads on this topic before, some quite detailed and one in particular a little lively! You might profitably spend a rainy Sunday flicking through all the old threads on this topic and reading any of interest to you. Here's a head-start:

Two-pager

Another...

and Another

Lively three-pager!

and one on Backthrust.

Quite a bit of the previously-published stuff is speculative, and has been heavily influenced by Ellis-Brown's text. Even though a number of members have built their own, and hunted with them, any additional hands-on experience and first-hand advice is highly valued. I would be interested in your views on 'moment of inertia' and how to retain the quick-handling characteristics so important in designing a working SxS double. Many US 'smiths appear to be reluctant to slim down the barrels towards the muzzles, which is crucial to the 'liveliness' of the finished rifle.

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au


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Judson
.300 member


Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Marrakai]
      #39208 - 17/10/05 10:12 AM


I built my rifle rather heavy as I have Rheumatoid Arthritis through my whole body. I would rather carry a heavy, in this case 12.5 pounds rifle then deal with the recoil of a 10.5 pound gun, which is about right for a 450 # 2 N.E. However weight and the speed of which a gun handles are not total oppisites. Ballance is critical as well as stock design. If you do not believe this pick up a Holland & Holland .577 and try its swing. No I do not want to carry it all day in 110 degree climates but in these times we do not have to.
Probably the biggest reason that most U.S. gunsmiths do not like the tappered to the muzzel barrels is due to the fact that on this side of the pond most of us do not shoot rifles with any degree of recoil. Many people who stop by my shop are reluctant to shoot a .338 as they feel it will kick them out from under their their hat. For the most part up here in Maine a 30-06 is about the upper recoil limit. You have to look at it in this perspective. Most Americans who hunt fire around a box of ammo per year. Few have hunted out side the U.S. and those that have for the most part still fall into the box a year catigory. Recoil is somthing you have to work up to, just like with a child, you do not start them out with a 12 gauge. The light muzzel weight double you mention is great for a seasoned shooter but most over here would find the recoil too much.
I have to put this in though, A properly designed rifle with a bit more weight may be a tad slower to bring up but it will be one hell of a lot faster on that second trigger.
I am no expert but with that rifle of mine I can put 2 bullets into an 8" circle at 50 yards in under 4 seconds on a good day. I do not really know how good that is but I feel sort of pleased with that.


--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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Judson
.300 member


Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39209 - 17/10/05 10:49 AM


I mentioned before that this action did not have a stock. Now for the stock. The Blanc is South African Blackthorn and it was given to me on my first African hunt so it seemed right to use on this rifle. In our shop we specialise in building stocks/ rifles to fit the shooter and thus stock design is critical. The less drop the less muzzel jump you have. This is due to the fact that the recoil is directed straighter into your shoulder. Also if you look at your shoulder and where your eyes are you will notice that where the butt of a rifle ends up and your eye do not line up. This is where cast off for a right handed shooter, cast off for a left handed shooter comes in. If you angle the stock around .5" and have minimal drop you will find that you do not have to drop your cheek to the stock or cheek piece and you will also see that the rifle tends to point when shouldered to where you are looking. This does not just apply to double guns but any gun. In my eyes stock design is critical to how a gun handles. If you look at the picture of me shooting the 450 you will see that the gun is off the sand bags, however if you look close you will see that the muzzel is not jumping I am rocking back. Set up like this recovery for a second shot is minimal and you feel less recoil as it is directed against your shoulder and not against your shoulder and cheek bone.
The first thing you do when designing a stock is look at the wood and try to see the stock in the blank. You want the grain to flow from as far back in the butt as possable through the grip and into the forearm as possable. Never go for pretty grain over strength!
Once you have done this cut out the blank and inlet the action, once this is done the fun begins!!!! Fit your pad or butt plate and all lines work forward from there. A good rifle will have smooth flowing lines, your eye will follow from one end of the rifle to the other with no harsh angles which stop this flow. Strive for that perfect marrage between wood and metal. When you run your hands over a good rifle you should only notice a difference in texture between the wood and the metal.
When I was 12 years old I was told this by Mr. Wallace Gussler, these are words I never forgot and strive to achieve.
If this picture comes out it will show me fitting the pad to the stock. I had drawen out its size prior to roughing out the stock but as it is now time for the final shapping the pad has to be installed so that it can be worked down with the stock to achieve as near to perfect fit as possable. From this piont on the pad will not be removed from the stock, all sanding and finishing will have the pad in place so that it will blend in perfectly.

--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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NE450No2
.375 member


Reged: 10/01/03
Posts: 942
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39219 - 17/10/05 04:27 PM

My 450 No2 has 28" barrels, weighs 11 3/4 Lbs.
It is ballanced perfectly and fits me better than any rifle I have. The 450 No2 is a great double rifle cartridge.


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Judson
.300 member


Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: NE450No2]
      #39248 - 18/10/05 09:14 AM

N.E. 450 # 2 I was wondering if I would find you here. Thank you for the loading information it has been a big help! I will be trying the 350 grain loads you mentioned tomorrow if it does not rain.
Now once we have the stock firret we must take care of the detailing. Shadow lines are nice but they should be fine and slightly under cut. I usually run a shadow line around the cheek piece which also has the edges undercut.
The wood should be cut nearly down to the metal and finished flush with the metal during sanding. To acomplish this you may as well plan on a bluing job as there is no other way to get a perfect wood to metal fit but to sand down the stock with the metal in place. If the gun you are restocking is engraved you have to be very careful as you do not want fadded or missing engraving where the wood meets the metal.
Hay, I am sorry if I am giving too much detail about all this, please let me know. At times I get a bit carried away as I love my job and ramble at times about my work.

For those of you not familiar with the 450#2 if this picture comes out you will see it compared to a .243 Winchester.


--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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JPeterson
.275 member


Reged: 08/10/05
Posts: 68
Loc: Wisconsin USA
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39249 - 18/10/05 09:34 AM

Please feel free to ramble. I, and I'm sure other members, find your project very interesting to say the least. I hope that you keep us updated on your progress.

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NE450No2
.375 member


Reged: 10/01/03
Posts: 942
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: JPeterson]
      #39265 - 18/10/05 06:08 PM

Judson, I agree with JPeterson. Give us all the details.
Building a double rifle is a great undertaking.
The more different double rifle calibres I shoot and help people load for the more I like the 450 No2.

I bought my 450 No2 on the recommendation of George Caswell at Champlin Arms. To say I am very happy with it is an understatement.
I also bought my 450/400 3 1/4" on his recommendation. I have been well pleased with that double rifle and with the calibre.
Either one of the 450/400's just might be the best double rifle calibre for the Safari of the Modern Man.
Still the 450 No2, with an elephant in its sights, is MY Holy Grail.


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Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 2681
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: NE450No2]
      #39266 - 18/10/05 07:08 PM

The problem with building heavy-calibre double rifles on shotgun actions using the existing monobloc is that it is near impossible to get the weight-distribution right. Shotgun barrels taper steeply from the breech-face, so they make it hard to keep the weight high around the area of the hinge-pin, 'between the hands' as it were.

Its fine to say that such a big-calibre rifle should be 'heavy' and leave it at that, but that extra couple of pounds we're talking about simply must be added between the hands, NOT in the barrels out towards the muzzles. To build a 12.5 lb rifle on a shotgun action without making a new monobloc essentially means that the barrels will have to be made very heavy along their entire length, including the muzzles. Such rifles can't help but be un-handy to hunt with, as well as being tiring to carry. I know: my .577, although short, has these tendencies. A lively, quick-handling double simply has to have the weight back between the hands, and isn't that the essence of shooting a SxS double after all?

Perhaps this sketch will help illustrate my point:



I have often thought of trying to get hold of depleted uranium rod to insert into the head of the butstock, or at least a steel-tube filled with mercury. This would add weight back of the hinge-pin, but just forward of the trigger-hand. Still in the 'too-hard' basket at the moment however. Simply adding weight under the recoil-pad to 'balance' a heavy-barrelled rifle does more harm than good IMHO, as it increases the moment of inertia even more and makes the rifle even less lively to shoot in the hunting field.

Once you have hunted with a well-proportioned double, you will find it difficult to use heavy-barreled rifles again. My Jeffery .400 has really spoiled me in this regard. Here's a pic of GG's old .400 double, a Webley boxlock, which illustrates well the proper proportions for correct 'moment of inertia', or good handling qualities.





This is what we should be striving for when we make the effort to build rifles out of shotguns, or indeed from scratch, rather than simply making a shooting machine that has two barrels.

I hope the readership will take my comments in good faith, they are not intended to criticize anyone's stirling efforts, but hopefully will add something of value to the think-tank. As I said at the beginning, it is near-on impossible to achieve this magic weight-distribution, but imho THAT, NE450No2, is the TRUE Holy Grail of double rifle craftsmanship!

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au


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Will
.333 member


Reged: 04/02/03
Posts: 303
Loc: Kansas
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Marrakai]
      #39276 - 18/10/05 11:29 PM

Marrakai,

You might be right about this inertia thing, maybe, but personally I see no reason for the heavy barrels and heavy weight to begin with. All the 450's are only 5100 ft-lbs and needing an 11 -12 lb. rifle, as in the old days for sure, is just baloney. A kid could shoot those old clubs without getting hurt! Like a 450/400 I say advertised at Cabelas, almost 12 lbs. That can hardly be handy regardless of the weight distribuition.

Handy isn't really found until you get down to the small frame 375's and 9.3's, in the 8 lb. or less class. IMO.

--------------------
_________________________________________________
Bill Stewart

Once you have been amongst them, there is no such thing as too much gun.


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Judson
.300 member


Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Marrakai]
      #39287 - 19/10/05 07:52 AM


Thank you for your input and your point about ballance is well taken. I am lucky with this project as have you ever picked up a piece of Blackthorn? This wood is very heavy and dence so keeping the balance was not much of a problem. Also the quater rib is not hollow as many are I wanted the weight back there. No this caliber rifle does not need this much weight but like I mentioned with the R.A. I would like the rifle heavy to slow the recoil a bit.
There is a guy around here who builds 45-70 doubles by sleezing the barrels, he uses such actions as Savage 311 and other low strength and cheep doubles not only IMHO dumb but it really shows your point about the ballance they are clubs, and slow clubs at that! My rifle balances just forward of the hindge pin with out the scope and a bit back on the action with it in place.
This point about ballance is good to bring up. In our shop we specialise in building guns to fit the shooter. I want a rifle, when brought to the shoulder to point where the shooter is looking. This involves not only such things as cast off or cast on but also just as important is ballance. A heavy, properly fitted and ballanced rifle, (if you are used to the weight) will still handle fast and point true. The same can not be said for a poorly ballanced and fitted light rifle.
One more thing, that is a very nice rifle you have there!! And keep throwing your two cents worth into the think tank I value your imput and comments.

--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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Judson
.300 member


Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39333 - 20/10/05 08:21 AM


Back to the stock work I guess. Once the stock is fully shaped and detailed it is time to start the sanding out and finishing. With all metal that meets the wood in place and your pad or butt plate on the stock it is time to begin. The rough sanding is done with 120 grit, this is just to get rid of the file and rasp marks. Once finished with this I wet sand with 220 grit using mineral spirits as a wetting agent and so the paper does not fill up so fast. When no sanding marks from the 120 are able to be found and the stock is still wet with the mineral spirits I wipe it down and apply the first coat of finish.
For finish I use either thinned Birch Wood Casy Tur Oil or Super Goo (We make that stuff) or a combination of the two. This first coat can be brushed on however as finishing goes on each coat is rubbed in by hand. Once the first coat dries again the sanding process starts again, but this time it is with 320 grit and mineral spirits. Again wipe the stock down, apply a coat of finish and keep going with finer and finer paper until all the pores of the wood are filled. I go as fine as 600 grit during the finishing and the last few coats are buffed out instead of sanding. I never use any filler partly because most contain silica which eats checkering tools but primarily because fillers make the pores of the wood stand out. This process of wet sanding, wipeoff the dust and apply a coat of finish process fills the pores with the wood dust and finish. Since I do not have a digital camera you will have to waite a bit for pictures of how the 450s stock looks finished. I still have to do the checkering, what do you guys think I should do, point pattern or a fill in Fleur Di Lis pattern.

--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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tinker
.416 member


Reged: 12/03/05
Posts: 3487
Loc: Nevada
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39336 - 20/10/05 11:01 AM

Checkering?

My vote's for a fill in Fleur Di Lis pattern.
Should look nice and it'll have a bit of an American gunsmith feel to it...


--Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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MauserRifle
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Reged: 15/03/05
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Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39337 - 20/10/05 11:20 AM

Judson

I just returned home last night and have only just finished reading all of your posts on your DR. Thank you for such a datailed report on your project and the fine photos you have included with your posts.

I personally have throughly enjoyed reading your step by step report. You are going to have one fine DR to be very proud of when finished.

I personally like the point pattern!

--------------------
Mauser Rifle

Everyday is a great day, some days are just better than others!


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Judson
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Reged: 21/09/05
Posts: 190
Loc: St. Albans Maine U.S.A.
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: MauserRifle]
      #39486 - 22/10/05 08:54 AM


As to the checkering, one vote for each style. I guess I will waite for a few more votes. One thing I have found about building double rifles is the hole concept is addictive!!! You find some long forgotten gun with all the charistics needed for a double rifle and reserect it into some thing finer then it was and give it a new life.
It is sort of like working with an old, military action you fuss, cut, tinker until it is just right and from the ugly duckling comes the swaun. I guess that is what I like about building custom rifles for a living. I also guess I am trying to tell you I found another canidate for a double rifle. This too is a French 16 gauge, (Where are all the 12 gauges?) it has side clips, third fastener, double under lugs and double bites. The cute little gun was double proofed and this means its proof loads were far higher then pressure then the 450#2 or the 475#2 so I have several choices. I am on the reluctant side about the 475 due to the gun being a 16 but the pressure per squaire inch is the same and due to the bigger bore it would come out lighter and ballance better then a 450.
If any of you have had experance with the .475#2 N.E. let me know what you think, please. This new project gun was built by Brunet A Chartres and is lightly engraved with a color case hardened reciever, do any of you know any thing about his guns?

--------------------
It is the small calibers that are the biggest bores.


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mickeyModerator
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Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4639
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: Building a double rifle [Re: Judson]
      #39492 - 22/10/05 10:29 AM

I'm not sure what info you are looking for about the 475 #2. I can tell you that the most accurate double I have ever seen, or even heard about, is a 475 #2 Holland. 8 shots inside an inch at 100 yards.

It belongs to a friend who refuses to sell it for some reason.


It will do anything that any of the others will. It will make a bigger thwamp when you drop it in the chamber.




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Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.


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