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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Single Shots & Combination Guns

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TilleyMan
.333 member


Reged: 23/08/05
Posts: 272
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Ruger No 1 in .303 British?
      #76394 - 13/04/07 03:52 PM

I've always been keen on the .303 British cartridge.

Grew up using a No1 Mk3 and then a No4 Mk1 SMLE, then recently bought a very original Martini Enfield .303.

Lots of fun, but I found myself wanting more refinement than a SMLE and a more modern single shot with the ability to easily mount a scope. Don't want to start butchering an 1899 rifle still with 90% original bluing!

The obvious choice would be a Ruger No 1, inexplicably not currently offered in this classic calibre

So what is involved with rebarrelling a second hand No 1?

Is it just a matter of swapping over barrels, re-attaching the rib and replacing/modifying the extractor to suit the rimmed cartridge on ANY No 1 or are certain existing calibres more suitable?

Any advice gratefully received

Cheers

TM


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308
.275 member


Reged: 26/01/07
Posts: 61
Loc: Wangaratta/Victoria/Australia
Re: Ruger No 1 in .303 British? [Re: TilleyMan]
      #76420 - 13/04/07 09:15 PM

I think a Ruger No1 in .405Win is the closest to the .303Brit ,most you would have to do is change the barrel I would think.

308


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sbs470
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Reged: 15/04/04
Posts: 378
Loc: Sheffield Tasmania
Re: Ruger No 1 in .303 British? [Re: 308]
      #76428 - 13/04/07 10:51 PM

I have a No1 which I rebarrelled to 303/25.I put a 30 inch heavy octagonal barrel on it and a 20X Leupold .using 120 gr sierra HPBT it will shoot 1/2 inch at a 100 and sub MOA at 400.Its not a pretty rifle but its bloody accurate.I'm sure a 303 on a ruger No 1 will just as good as my experiment has .Sadly the 303 has not had a lot of good results over the years as the cartridge has never been paired with a good action and good barrel.

good luck with yours
sbs470


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Otto
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Reged: 15/09/05
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Loc: Arizona, USA
Re: Ruger No 1 in .303 British? [Re: 308]
      #76429 - 13/04/07 11:01 PM

It depends on the type of rifle you aspire to build. My mental picture of a .303 single shot has a long, slender barrel and short forend. If you want this type of rifle you would best begin with a Ruger 1A in any caliber. You get the forend channel that is correct, the barrel has a clunky front site and sling band you can use on the .303 barrel, and the 1/4 rib will also likely work. The only part you have to buy is an extractor for .405, about 15 bucks. The 405 #1 has a heavier barrel that really wouldn't let you use any of these parts on a slender 303 barrel.
Otto


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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26867
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Ruger No 1 in .303 British? [Re: Otto]
      #76794 - 18/04/07 12:30 AM

Otto - I could see a "S" type model of 2001, with Alex Henry forewood, 26" slender barrel, fine front sight band and 1/4 rib in a 7x57R(or standard) or .303. The barrel should be at least 24" and 26" would be proper for the single shot.
: .303 chambering reamers can be purchased for a .308 groove diameter is this is just a handloading proposition, and then 220 gr. Hornady's could be used to advantage. Otherwise, there are some barrel makers producing .312's, I think.
: I have a buddy building a match rifle, .303 chamber on a .308 barrel.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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TilleyMan
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Reged: 23/08/05
Posts: 272
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Re: Ruger No 1 in .303 British? [Re: DarylS]
      #76840 - 18/04/07 08:41 AM

Daryl

That is along the lines of what i am thinking of... there are a couple of barrel makers here that produce pretty much whatever you want in a .311-.312 barrel.

Agree re 26" barrel length, but I tend to favour a classic Euro look, and like a subtle schnabel fore end tip (like a Brno ZKW465) and a barrel band foresight and sling mount. A well proportioned hexagonal or part hexagonal barrel could also be an alternative I think.

I'm planning a NEGC optic fibre barrel band foresight combined with a QD fast peep mounted on the receiver dovetails, and a EAW swing lock QD scope mount, combined with a steel tubed Pecar 3-7x35mm No 4 reticle scope (which i just happen to have looking for a home!) should complete a flexible, reasonably light, reasonably powerful classic single shot hunting rifle.

I think a rimmed cartridge just seems 'right' for a single shot, 7x57R may be common in Europe but brass is rare and expensive here. Still a lot of .303 ammunition, components, reamers etc here in Australia, Woodleigh also make a couple of premium .303 projectiles that come highly regarded by those who have used them.

The Ruger No1 action in .303 should be able to be loaded up to at least P14 level pressures, which should make the old warhorse round really sing compared to more subdued performance I am used to in SMLE's and the Martini Enfield

Have just bought a Kleppinger single set trigger as the first step of the project, now on the lookout for a No1 donor rifle!

BTW why is the 2001 Ruger No 1 Type S considered better than others?
Apart from the usual checks, are there any particular things to look out for for when buying a secondhand Ruger No 1?

Cheers

TM


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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
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Re: Ruger No 1 in .303 British? [Re: TilleyMan]
      #76953 - 19/04/07 06:45 AM

I believe you mean Octagonal barrel, as a hex is 6 sided and was/is never used for rifle barrels.
: Yes - I like Euro stocks too, like the CZ "Lux" and the old BRNO ZKK stocks. Splinter (short Euro) forends are my favourite for that part.
: I prefer a Sheard gold bead or bronze/brass/ivory round bead to any fibreopticmodernpiceof****plasticsight - sorry.
: There is no bolt action made today that is stornger than the Ruger #1. The will take pressures in stride that will lock up a P-14 or P-17.
: You should be able to get 2,300fps, maybe more, with 215gr. Woodleighs.
: It is best that the first time you fire your new (not reclaimed) brass, that it perfectly fit the chamber or it will stretch foreward at the web. If the brass headspace is sloppy, you can expand the necks to .358 ID, then size them only enough to fit your chamber. This will give a 'false shoulder, or secondary shoulder' which will hold the case back aginst the block for fireforming. Seating the bullets out to though the rifling lands also helps form the cases properly. Once fireformed, never touch the shoulder again, unless you cannot chamber a sized case. Each time you push the shoulder back, then fire it, it will re-stretch again at the web and finally separate at that point. Old bras is already started on that avenue, sometimes drastically, sometimes not so badly. The gross taper of the case is the major cause of excessive stretching even though the bras might fit perfectly. Generally, .303's ar generously chambered and since the rim holds the case back aginst the block, the case blows forward, stretching at the web until it separates. Careful reloading will allow many shots per case, whereas pushing the shoulder bach each time greatly reduces case life. The higher the pressures, the more stretch per firing. You need agood set of calipers for this, dials and digitals are easier to read for most people.
: Watch case overall length. If you can get a reamer print for your barrel, so much the better. Record the measurement from the top of the rim to the case mouth and trim your brass to between .005" to .010" shorter than that max measurement, or use case rim base to case mouth from the chart. Unfortuneately, most charts don't show the total overall length, only from the top of the rim to the mean little shoulder.(45 degree angle ahead of the case mouth) Many charts will show a measurement for the rim, as in .063" (example only)
; Good luck - cool project. I have a Ruger #1 in .218Bee with 6,500 rounds through it. I haven't decided what to do with it now that the throat's gone - maybe a .375 something flanged, just because.
: I preferred the earlier #1 "S" due to it's 26" slim barrel and alexhenry forestock. Most of them I saw had exceptional wood of the 70's Ruger #1's. The actions are identical.
; What to look out for - ?? Abuse? Cracked wrists, I guess. Not much that a guy wouldn't see anyway.


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TilleyMan
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Reged: 23/08/05
Posts: 272
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Re: Ruger No 1 in .303 British? [Re: DarylS]
      #76979 - 19/04/07 12:14 PM

Thanks for such a detailed reply.

Yes, my mistake octagonal is what I meant

Reason I mentioned the fibre optic front sight is because I looked at one on a Chapuis DR and it REALLY glowed. Did look a bit fragile I admit...

Sorry, I'm not familiar with a 'reamer print'... do you mean an accurate cast of the chamber using Cerrosafe or similar?

I'll keep a lookout for an early 70's No 1... kicking myself though as I was at an auction about 12 months ago when a Leupold scoped No1 in .270 with a stunning fiddleback stock went for just A$650.

Of course that was *before* I thought about this project... will keep you posted on progress!


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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26867
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Ruger No 1 in .303 British? [Re: TilleyMan]
      #77044 - 20/04/07 06:02 AM

By "reamer print", I meant the drawing of of the reamer form the reamer grinders themselves, with all the measurements. Dave Kiff at Pacific Tool and Gauge will send you any prints you want. I use Pacific chambering reamers now exclusively although I've used Clymer and Manson reamers too. I now prefer the Pacific & have had excellent customer support and good raport' with them.
: I am currently considering re-barreling my Ruger #1 .218 Bee to the .375/03 that Paul Mathews and his son worked on some time ago. For North American game where I hunt, it's a excellent round. As you say, .303 brass is very plentiful in Commonwealth countries.
: Keep me/us posted on your #1 Project
: A full sized Martini with custom stock would also be a fun project for your .303, and perhaps easier to find for you.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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bobc
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Reged: 18/05/05
Posts: 31
Re: Ruger No 1 in .303 British? [Re: DarylS]
      #77148 - 21/04/07 04:06 AM

Daryl, are reamers and dies available in 375/303? Bob

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DarylS
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Reged: 10/08/05
Posts: 26867
Loc: Beautiful British Columbia, Ca...
Re: Ruger No 1 in .303 British? [Re: bobc]
      #77150 - 21/04/07 04:48 AM

I assume they are. For dies, you'd need a few fired cases. I'd have Hornady or Lee make the dies for me. The reamer should be avialable from Pacific.
: One need only ask for a reamer for the Improved .303 necked up to .375. If there are other than standard dimensions desired, that would also be passed on, such as .001" over head size for new unfired .303 brass. If other than standard neck length or throat was desired, etc.
; It would be best to pick a manufacture of brass, buy 300 of them (more or less), such as Federal, WW or RP. I'd personally go for Federal brass. Measure the head size, add .001" and order the reamer to that size. I'd pick .440" as the shoulder diameter, with a standard neck length and 40 degree shoulder, leaving the shoulder placement to Pacific as they'll get it right. The shoulder diameter I listed will give .008" taper per side, which will work perfectly. The head diameter would be .458".
: BTW - I have made bullets for my .458 2" from shortened .303 brass, filled with a lead core and formed over into a round nose - excellent penetration or expansion, depending on the alloy of the core - good accuracy too, same as store bought bullets. I can see why John Buhmiller and Harold Johnson used them.
: The reulting .375/.303 case should give around 2,300fps to 2,400fps with 270gr. RN's or spitzers and would make a very nice big game rifle for B.C. or Alaska. At around 2,500fps or a bit more, with a 235gr. Barnes XTS, one could make do with one bullet for all game.
; To form brass, one merely necks up .303 brass using a tapered .44 mag expander, then size the neck down using other dies in the junk drawer, to get the shoulder in the right place. One needs to fire 3 of these so they fit the new chamber then send the cases off so dies can be made. Another method is to load up about 10gr. of bullseye, fill the .303 case with cream of wheat, and fire it into a trash can(steel). This will blow the case out to fit the chamber so dies can be made. Due to the massive stretching(possibly in the web area) involved, these cases shouldn't be used for loading, only for making the dies. If the ase isn't formed perfectly, increase the bullseye until they are, one grain at a time. In the .17AH, I use 7 grs. bullseye and piece of toilet paper for the plug, so 10gr. should be just fine in the .303. Do NOT use a bullet for this forming.

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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