Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact
NitroExpress.com: The BEST African plains game calibre

View recent messages : 24 hours | 48 hours | 7 days | 14 days | 30 days | 60 days | More Smilies


*** Enjoy NitroExpress.com? Participate and join in. ***
You are not logged in. [Login] Main Index · Search · Active Topics
New user · Who's Online · FAQ · Calendar

Hunting >> Hunting in Africa & hunting dangerous game
Previous topic Previous   Search Results   Next topic Next   Threaded Mode Threaded  

Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | >> (show all)
Gibbs505
.333 member


Reged: 09/08/03
Posts: 442
Loc: BC, Canada
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: DPhillips]
      #16686 - 14/07/04 03:28 AM

No offence taken. I would love to get a double rifle in 303!!

--------------------
So I can't spell, so what?

Those who beat their swords into ploughshares, will plough for those who don't!

Those who fail to learn from history will be doomed to repeat it

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
DPhillips
.375 member


Reged: 09/10/03
Posts: 819
Loc: Alaska
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: Gibbs505]
      #16687 - 14/07/04 03:32 AM

I feel certain now, especially with ovis making the sacrifice of joining me on this sojourn, we will have a definitive answer for you in no less than 20 years.

Maybe.

Definitely maybe.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
TerryR
.224 member


Reged: 13/07/04
Posts: 42
Loc: Greensburg, Pa.
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #16688 - 14/07/04 04:46 AM

Nitrox
I doubt that you can bring in a rimfire - I know that you can't in Botswana. I did use a 22LR on my first hunt - my PH's. We used it to pot shoot francoln. It was an old Brno with express, yes express, sights. We had a ball with it. The only reason that he could have it, they are illegal in Botswana, is that it was his grandfather's and thus already in the country when they were banned.
The francoln pie was excellent.
By the way - wouldn't a 22 rimfire double rifle be ton's of fun.
Terry

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Safarischorsch
.275 member


Reged: 28/02/04
Posts: 98
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #16691 - 14/07/04 06:34 AM

Yes! 8x68S with RUAG CDP bullet or this bullet here:

http://home.snafu.de/l.moeller/Kupferjagdgeschosse.htm

why? Powerfull, accurate, no belt!

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
jhrod
.224 member


Reged: 26/06/04
Posts: 7
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #16696 - 14/07/04 11:02 AM

FWIW from a guy with exactly 1 (one) plains game safari to his credit.

I couldn't have been happier with my .338 WinMag.

My eland was quartering away at about a 45 degree angle, 80m or so away. The 250 grain Nosler hit him about the third stripe back, and proceeded forward and through the bull's off-side shoulder, coming to rest as a bump under the skin. Thru the scope I caught the bull's entire left side cave in when the bullet went through, and I thought he was going to topple and die right there. He caught himself at the last second however, ran 40 yards, ending with a mouthful of dirt from his face-first death skid.

My kudu was virtually the same shot from the opposite side. The bullet exited from the offside shoulder and the bull kicked his back legs in the air. He ran 40 yards and took the nose-first dive into the dirt.

My zebra stallion was looking right at me at 80 yards. When I pulled the trigger, his head jerked straight forward and then he simply flipped over on his back and kacked right there, much to the delight of our
tracker.

My impala was looking almost straight away from me at 100 yards. The bullet entered just in front of his right ham, and exited out his neck just in front of his right shoulder. He went down so fast I didn't see it happen in the scope.

For all these animals, meat damage at entry or exit was very minimal.

Recoil is very manageable, the Federal premium loads with the 250 grain Nosler are fairly reasonable in price and very easy to find, and it obviously has the oomph to get the job done on plains game from impala to eland. The perfect rifle for my "keep it simple, the gun is just a
tool" mentality.

Our last night in Bulawayo, we were out at a couple of drinking establishments with 4 other the PH's from our operator. All asked what gun I was shooting, and when I said .338, all just got a big peaceful smile on their face. The "approval" from these guys was instantaneous and unanimous - which is all I needed to see/hear.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
500NE
.224 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 14
Loc: Vienna, Austria
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #16779 - 16/07/04 07:44 AM

For mass debate's sake:

Considering the 30's as a personal minimum and the .375 as a sensible maximum, anything over 2400fps within that range would make sense.

The real middle would be arround the .338 which would indeed be a good choice in either configuration!
(My personal favorite beeing the .338RUM)

Any opinions?

Grettings,
500NE

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
mikeh416Rigby
.450 member


Reged: 24/02/03
Posts: 6051
Loc: The beautiful Oley Valley, PA....
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: 500NE]
      #16789 - 16/07/04 10:30 AM

I've been an admirer of the 338 and 340 for some time. I don't own one, but friends of mine who shoot them, have never had any complaints. Four years ago a friend of mine shot a Kudu from around 150 yards away. It was faceing him straight on, and at the shot, the bull went straight down with all 4 legs splayed out. The bullet entered the center of the chest, and exited the right rear ham. The bullet was a 250 grain Nosler Partition.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39303
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: 500NE]
      #16798 - 16/07/04 02:56 PM

500NE

Welcome to NE.com. A decade or so I enjoyed walking through the woods of Vienna and observing the wild boar and other game.

There was a reason that the .318 and to some extent the .333 Jeffrey were popular way back when. The .338 Win Mag was a commercial copy of the .333 OKH (?) which was based on these rounds.

I think the .338 RUM would make a killer round except I can't stand Remington. Little bit over-bore though. I like the idea of a 8x68S as it is a little less in capacity, and has bullets from 150 gr to 275 gr to choose from. Here at home I would use about a 150 to 180 gr and elsewhere the 220 gr + would not go astray but still have decent trajectory.

Have used one but do not own one . A .318 will appear first I think though as it is just waiting to be rebarrelled.


--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
500NE
.224 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 14
Loc: Vienna, Austria
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #16802 - 16/07/04 07:42 PM

NitroX

Thanks for the Welcome.
I actually had been a member at the old MSN forum, then lost touch for a while and was delighted to see that me old username was not yet taken...

Re .318 and others:
Sure there was a reason the .318 was popular! If you're also an admirer or Mr. "Doktari" Robertson and others of the old school, it probably was the same reason other classic calibers like 7x57, .30-06 or 9,3x62 where popular in Africa and worked (rather: are working) well:
Good Bullets w/ a SD over .300 and a muzzle velocity around or slightly above 2400fps.

So, yes the .318 is a wonderful cartridge, but: bullet supply is "somewhat" limited and have fun if the airline mixes up you luggage and you are left w/ your gun but without ammo in MMBA!

So if you choose a .318, it's probably for a nostalgic reason and hey, since I own a 500NE I'm certainly not the one blaming you for that!

Similar the 8x68:
It truly is a wonderful cartridge (hey, a beltless magnum, just what the doctor prescribed...), however bullet choice and availability (outside europe that is...) is simply not as wide as .30 or .338 (although it got a lot better now w/ Woodleigh, Barnes and others also offering 8mm stuff).
Also, one needs to be aware that most european manufacturers use bullets that are - imho - to soft for africa!

So: What fascinates me about the .338 calibers is the incredible choice of bullets and yes the .338 RUM would be a killer round! But since I'm also not to fond of Rem 700 rifles in Africa, I'm still considering my options! (Even had a chat w/ the Blaser guys a while ago about a custom barrel, but they don't see a market for the .338RUM)

Greetings,
500NE

BTW: So what did you do in good old Vienna and whereabout did you walk the woods?

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Anansi
.224 member


Reged: 15/07/04
Posts: 12
Loc: CA USA
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: 500NE]
      #16825 - 17/07/04 06:52 AM

How about the 6.5 (either the Swedish Mauser, 260, Rem, or WM) It has great sectional density in 140 or 160 grain bullets.

--------------------
Life is a little like sailing. You can't always follow your charted course, and you your destination may be different from what you had wanted.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
McCray
.224 member


Reged: 10/02/03
Posts: 20
Loc: Oklahoma
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #16841 - 17/07/04 02:47 PM

Not enough experience to matter much, but I used an 8mm Rem. mag with 220 grain Xs last time and it worked like a champ. Used a 416 Rem. on the eland.

Next time I plan on using a rebarreled Mod 70 in 340 Weatherby. 250 grain Swifts or 240 North Forks.

Now back to your regularly scheduled Remington bashing.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
NitroXAdministrator
.700 member


Reged: 25/12/02
Posts: 39303
Loc: Barossa Valley, South Australi...
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: 500NE]
      #16843 - 17/07/04 03:09 PM

Yes ammunition components and loaded ammo are a problem with rare cartridges. But if you want something different you can't expect to run with the pack.

Woodleigh makes .330 calibre (.318) projectiles as do some African bullet manufacturers. At the worst I would try swaging some bullets down.

What I want for my .318 is the real classic English stocked Mauser .318 ie the slim short forend stock rifle setup for express sighs. But I probably will still mount a scope in QDs to make better use of it.

8mm. Woodleigh makes projectiles as again some African manufacturers. The softer bullets for the 8x57 would not be as big a problem as I would use these on feral game and similar, and a soft bullet is spectacular on these lighter game and kills extremely well. And cheaper. The fast light bullets also provide a good trajectory out to 350 metres or so. A .30-06 kills emphatically so a 8x68S will be even more effective.

I do like the range of bullets available in .338 too.


Welcome back to NE.com.

I was in Vienna in 1989 on a holiday when living in London. I do not remember which woods they were. If I remember the right forest, it was close to the city, fenced and public. There were Hochsitz for the hunting season and on entering the forests gate, wildboar piglets fed right up to us and around us on a walking track and the sow also passed us. Not particularly wild but I generally don't like to get between a mother and its young. A couple of good boars fed in a grass field.

While we walked in the forest, a hunter musician played a horn with some stirring tunes and later we came across him walking hom and an Austrian couple dressed in fine hunting greens stopped to talk to him.

I believe there were also small fenced paddocks fo moufflon sheep and some fallow deer near the entrance.

Perhaps it was near a famous Hapsberg palace the name of which I am trying to remember.

Vienna was an enjoyable city to visit.

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
AdamTayler
.375 member


Reged: 22/03/04
Posts: 688
Loc: B.C.
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #16868 - 19/07/04 01:52 AM

I have not been yet (hopefully Namibia in 2009), but my first choice would be a 7x57 and secondly a 338-06.

--------------------
It's the journey, not the destination.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Robie
.275 member


Reged: 04/04/03
Posts: 61
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: AdamTayler]
      #16870 - 19/07/04 04:06 AM

A rifle-drilling in 9,3x74R., and maybe a light rifle (Zoli/Mannlicher) in 6,5x55 or 7x57.

Robie J.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
500NE
.224 member


Reged: 06/01/03
Posts: 14
Loc: Vienna, Austria
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #16896 - 19/07/04 08:11 PM

Exactly, if you want something special, one needs to leave the beaten track!

I'm sure such a (98' system-based?) .318 will be a real joy! Don't forget a Rigby-Style peep-sight on that rifle for the real classic touch!

Johannsen (http://www.johannsen-jagd.de/magnumsysteme.html) for instance makes awfully nice systems and rifles based on newly made 98-systems, and although not exactly what one would call cheap, he also offers to have EAW scope bases directly machined into the double square bridges! What a joy to look at!

Also no argument that nowadays bullets availability is no real argument anymore, other than price...

BTW: I'm pretty sure the park you mention is the "Lainzer Tiergarten" which used to be a private hunting ground of the emperor. Lots of pigs and other game (deer) to see and yes, they also do hunt there! (They normally have 2 large driven hunts for pigs a year, with mostly the rich and famous as guests...). There is also a little charlet in the park that is called "Hermesvilla", that now hosts exhibitions and a little cafe shop.
(And yes, the Habsburg summer residence, Schoenbrunn castle, is not to far away...)

Greetings from Vienna,
500NE

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
shrike
.224 member


Reged: 16/07/04
Posts: 29
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #16965 - 21/07/04 12:36 PM

Would you throw in Giraffe and Eland.
Well, then go for the 8x68, 8mm Rem. Mag, 338 Win., 340 Wby,
or the .375 H&H, pick according how well you can shoot any of them.
For anything up to Zebra incl, the 30-06 probably do fine, or if you like, one of the .300 Mag. variations all with suitable bullets of course.

Remember, a well placed 06 bullet is a lot better then a poorly placed .375.

Picking any cartridge out of a suitable group seems like choosing women. Some hunters like short and squat ( .458 Win or .300 WSM) while others in our clan seem to prefer the tall slim looks ( .300 H&H or .375), yet others seek the tall husky teutonic variety women ( .470 or .5oo Jeffery). Hmmmmm...............

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
blackpowder
.224 member


Reged: 24/07/04
Posts: 1
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: mickey]
      #17138 - 24/07/04 12:58 PM

I hear what you're saying, even though others don't follow. The .318 WR is a wonderful cartridge for African plains game. In fact, I'll go so far as to say that I would not hesitate to use it on ANY species of African game.

Before I continue, anyone who thinks there is such a thing as an "ideal cartridge" is either inexperienced or a fool. Any experiened hunter knows that no such thing exists. Such talk is only the result of human thinking and opinion.

Granted, the .318 WR may not be ideal for the ponderous game. Nevertheless, I would not feel uncomfortable with it on elepahnt and rhino. Does an elephant care which cartridge has perforated its brain as it collapses in a heep?

I do not like belted cartidges, and I do not like ultra-super-duper-high-velocity-knock-your-socks-off cartridges. For that matter, any cartridge followed by the term "magnum" is, in my book, nothing but marketing hype, which is not to say that some "magnums" are not good cartridges.

Trajectory is of little importance to me, simply for the reason that all the fun in hunting is found in stalking up close. I do not shoot from 300 yards, and rarely from 200. I prefer to get within 100, for that is where the hunt unfolds. So, "ultra-magnums" are useless to me. If I had to choose one and only one cartridge to take to Africa, I would be content with a number of them. For example: .45-110, .405 WCF, .30-06, .400 BPE. My point is that the rifle and the cartridge have changed so little in the last 110 years that the tools of old are perfectly adequate--just as they were for the hunters of old.

I'll vote for the .318 WR, simply for nostalgia's sake.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
atkinson6
.375 member


Reged: 26/01/04
Posts: 678
Loc: Idaho
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: blackpowder]
      #17241 - 27/07/04 05:18 AM

Most Americans want to be over gunned for plainsgame, its part of the mistique of Africa...

To me the perfect plainsgame rifle is 300 H&H and I would include most of the 300 in that catagory..I like the 200 gr. Nosler to top off the best plainsgame rifle...

The .338 Win. with the 210 Nosler is its full equal.....

That said, anything from a 7x57 to a 416 Rem suits me fine..as long as I have a proper bullet for the game I am hunting.....I am a bit partial to the plain jane .308 with 180 gr. Noslers, it sure works.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Levallois
.300 member


Reged: 27/11/03
Posts: 137
Loc: Arizona, USA
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: atkinson6]
      #17338 - 28/07/04 12:45 PM

I'll be taking a circa 1920s G. Gibbs Mauser in .318WR with iron sights to the South African bushveld in 2006. If you can wait that long I'll tell you how good it was. I selected it because several sources claimed it was a close as you can get to "the best all-around" for Africa, it is a beautiful example of English gunmaking, AND there is the adventure and romance of using a historic caliber. In my humble opinion, you don't get that from the latest whiz-bang magnum. It's all in what floats your boat. My brother-in-law, who will be with me, doesn't give a hang about history and will be packing a scoped Weatherby in 300 Wby Magnum. We'll see who has the most fun.

John

--------------------
It ain't like it used to be, but it'll do.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Dark_Helmet
.333 member


Reged: 09/01/04
Posts: 399
Loc: Lincoln, Nebraska, USA
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: Levallois]
      #17625 - 06/08/04 03:57 AM

just to argue with Ray...

while I do think that many americans want to be overgunned, I just bought a 35 Whelen to mow-down bambi.... so take it with a grain of salt.

to me the mystique of hunting africa is largely tied to the fact that it is the last place on earth like it... while it is being slowly cizilized, places like the Moyowasi and most of Namibia are just wide-open with relatively little human infringement... that's one of the things I struggle with hunting close to home, not enough open space...

as such I think that whatever you use should carry with it something to that antique nature of the place. the 300H&H is likely the smallest round that could fit the "best" requirements, but there are a few others I think might be a bit better... and its just a tad small for my tastes.

the 358 Norma is sufficiently rare and powerful, yet it seems too modern, a true bastard-hybrid if you will.

the 338WM is about as perfect as you can get, and the response of the PHs mentioned a few posts above lays proof to that pudding. but it lacks soul IMO...

the 35 Whelen, while sufficiently old and rare, is, just like a 358 Norma, a bastard-child, and is quite difficult from a practical standpoint as ammo is not common. and in some instances it does lack in range...

the 338-06 is an interesting anomaly, but the 338WM is much more gun and much more practical and isn't exactly young...

the 30-06 isn't enough to call "best" but it surely is "enough" and I would heartily reccomend it to most any shooters looking for a PG gun that is easy on the wallet and shoulder.

so... what have I established??? well, just that most of the mid-level .3xx rounds are not ideal, either by capability or by character...

the 8mm rounds are impractical, and "best" can never be "impractical"

which makes me do a very very difficult thing... admit that I have absolutely no idea... but my first hunt with be with a 35 Whelen and a 375 H&H... well, maybe

--------------------
_________________________________________________________________
When someone says a rifle is "ugly," what they really mean is "push feed."

-me

(long live the Mauser 98!)

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
allenday
.333 member


Reged: 18/04/04
Posts: 318
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #17863 - 11/08/04 11:57 PM

I've had fantastic results with a .300 Winchester on everything from dik dik to eland, and for me it's dropped stuff just as well as the .375 H&H. It also shoots significantly flatter, kicks less, and is lighter to carry, so that's my nomination...........

ADay

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Mark_in_SC
.224 member


Reged: 06/06/04
Posts: 13
Loc: South Carolina Low Country, US...
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: allenday]
      #18170 - 19/08/04 06:56 AM

I'm with Allen and Ray on this one.

Holly and I have used my .300 Jarrett with 200 grain Nosler Partitions @ 3050 fps to take over 50 African plains game animals so far.

We haven't lost a single animal we've hit with this combination.

--------------------

NRA, GOA, & SCI Life Member
Protect our Hunting Heritage and 2nd Amendment rights!

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
500grains
.416 member


Reged: 16/02/04
Posts: 4732
Loc: Salt Lake City, Utah USA
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: atkinson6]
      #18202 - 20/08/04 01:34 AM

Other than for long distance shooting on the Kalahari, a 9.3 x 62 would seem about perfect. It has plenty of punch for the big stuff like eland and giraffe, and offers end to end penetration on zebra, kudu, waterbuck, etc. Yet the recoil is in the 30-06 class, pressures are low, there is not a lot of muzzle blast and the rifles are not big and bulky.

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Gibbs505
.333 member


Reged: 09/08/03
Posts: 442
Loc: BC, Canada
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: 500grains]
      #18216 - 20/08/04 02:44 AM

A 300 H&H magnum should be about perfect for me!!
If I had one that is!

--------------------
So I can't spell, so what?

Those who beat their swords into ploughshares, will plough for those who don't!

Those who fail to learn from history will be doomed to repeat it

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
470Nitro
.333 member


Reged: 17/09/03
Posts: 467
Loc: Madrid - Spain
Re: The BEST African plains game calibre [Re: NitroX]
      #18367 - 23/08/04 09:05 PM

I always use a 7 mm. Rem. Mag. on animals from Steenbok to wildebeest. Smallers or biggers should be shot with a big bore.

--------------------
-----
down by the river on a friday night
pyramid of cans in the pale moonlight
talkin' 'bout guns and dreamin 'bout women
never had a plan just a livin' for the minute

Post Extras: Print Post   Remind Me!   Notify Moderator  
Pages: 1 | 2 | 3 | >> (show all)


Previous topic Previous   Search Results   Next topic Next   Threaded Mode Threaded  

Extra information
0 registered and 32 anonymous users are browsing this forum.

Moderator:   

Print Topic

Forum Permissions
      You cannot start new topics
      You cannot reply to topics
      HTML is disabled
      UBBCode is enabled

Rating:
Topic views: 8840

Rate this topic

Jump to

Contact Us NitroExpress.com

Powered by UBB.threads™ 6.5.5


Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact


Copyright 2003 to 2011 - all rights reserved