|
|
|||||||
Singleshot rifles and in particular Sniders had NEVER said a thing to me until I came across this one. I know nada about things contraptions. I found this one to be `nice` and I bought for a £1000. What could go wrong except for a £1000?.. This Snider is from Isaac Hollis & Sons, London. The caliber could a .450 No rifle or Carbine...or perhaps a .450 Eley |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
I never heard of a 'non military' Snider before as well! It does make you wonder when it was converted, perhaps a date on the barrel / proof mark will determine that? I know this will be BP only, but it certainly is a unique piece rigbymauser........no wonder it caught your eye - I really do like it as well. The workmanship is superb! Certainly a wonderful pickup, you must endeavor to get this old lady up & running, it will be marvelous to see what caliber it finally is, the load data; but most important how she shoots! |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
What a GREAT rifle to own. Well worth the price of admission. Well done rigbymaster. All the checkering, engraving and horn schnabble forend tip - wonderful. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
I am sure that some civilian Sniders were made for the civilian sporting market. That arrow engraved through an S must mean something to someone out there. Yours has the later latch to stop the breech block popping open by accident. I have a similar but smaller Rook rifle one in .380 calibre - definitely made for civilians! HB |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Jens - as Daryl says everything is extra nice, a very good pick up 93X64mm - it is not a conversion, the Snider action was used by private gunmakers for everything from .297/230 to 8 bore. I have one, a lightweight in .577 Snider Isaac Hollis, later & Sons was a major manufacturer making many different Single Shot and Double actions They a re relatively easy to load for but better stick to BP Tony |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
That is a particularly nice example. I feel I’m in the same boat as you are, never all that moved by Sniders but would happily make room for a nice sporter such as yours. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
I recently acquired a I Hollis mini Snider in 360 rook, It looks similar to yours except not in as nice condition and it shrunk. mine also has an octagonal barrel. Its currently being professionally restored. lovely rifles and I suspect not many around. especially not in the condition of yours. what a treasure. Does anyone know what period I Hollis would have built these rifles? I'm guessing that the introduction of Martini actions both large and small would have spelt the end of Snider manufacture. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Very smart - and obviously rare, rifle; congratulations on your acquisition RigbyMauser! Louis |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
And then there are the J.C.Lord carbines. Problably the most common Snider sporting rifles. One source says only 200 made. For the number reported on British Militaria forum either all examples of the 200 survived or perhaps the figure is wrong. Not military but chambered 577 Snider. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
I beleacve the broad arrow is an acceptance mark for the British military. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Beautiful rifle, Jens! I have a weakness for these sporting Sniders. DD that carbine is too damn cool, complete with the ramrod! |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
The arrow through the S is the patent mark for Snider and should be on every Snider except for military/ordnance rifles/carbines One of my Sniders is made by Hollis for the Board of Ordnance, without it, all others have it J.C. & A. Lord were general merchants and supplied Birmingham trade arms amongst much else I do not know of any that did not come from Nepal??? anyone? Douglas - I got mine from Uncle Joel at the same time as yours IIRC TH44 |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Uncle Joel. Yep. Sold me this gun cheap as it was missing its from sight. Then turns around and gave my Granddaughter an Army-Navy documented Greener .22-Martini of course. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Some images. Pretty nice gun of its age. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
I tried to see if a .45-70 brass could fit? .Nope!...I think this one is a .450 Eley. Maybe a .45long colt brass would fit?. I`ll try that later. I might be lucky to fire lowpowered Magtec .45colt cowboy loads in it. I read in Oz these .450 Eley`s in these Snider were called `roorifles`..(think of Skippy).. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
With some simpel investigation the Danish 11,7x51 Remington case shorten to 1,5" comes closet to the .450 Eley No 1. Not a 100 perfect match..but`ll do. I doubt Eley Brothers have more left on the shelves for this one. I doubt too they`ll ever make it again..:LOL |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Good work. Now, waiting for the shooting results. Have fun. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Quote: Great info Rigbymauser! Yes definitely bigger than the .45 Colt, it would certainly have been used on skippy's back in it's day; maybe for hides unless you wanted a BIG hole in the middle of things or head shoot, but range estimation would be critical. Would certain be fun trying to see how accurate this one will be though - just to see if it can still be a 'roo rifle'? |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
I'll be the odd man out. I have always like Snider sporting rifles. I sold a lovely one for a client last fall. The lines remind me of percussion rifles and do love them. Steve |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Not a .450, so hope this doesn't result in a thread hijack, but I have one of the J.C.Lord carbines in rather nice condition. Posted a few pics of it on the British Militaria forums years ago, FYI: https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/britishm...075.html#p74187 Still haven't fired it! Love these things! |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
brilliant snider marrakai, do you ever shot pics with this? suspects its a .577 . 450 No. 1 is indeed a problem 454 casull rim diameter is under the base diameter so it dont work there is no case you dont have to change rim diameter and rim thickness on the lathe 11,7x45 R danish remington comes very close but its rare and berdan primed 11x58R spanish remington is a good match but expensive and sometimes hard to get 8x50R Lebel is a little bit over on the base but the case is very conical and I am sure its possible to reduce the little bit oversized base diameter on the lathe without weaking it for a blackpowder load. reduce rim diameter and thickness also, aneal case mouth and blowing out with a fire form load. the brass is common, cheap and available from PRVI |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Love Snider by Marrakai. Thanks Lars for your research. The .450 Eley No1 is its own. There is a few companies that makes custom brass if one supply them with case specs. I might order some...however the next thing is reloading dies. That too is a custom thing. From George Hoyems book `The history and development of small arms ammunition` Vol 3(1985) Maybe a shorten .450 nitro case will do the trick on this one. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
450 NE is to thick 45/70 brass to thin and 50/70 again much to thick |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
The belt of a 7mm Magnum could easily be turned down to the proper size for the base, at about .525"(13.35mm). The rim is only .532"(13.51mm), but would still likely work if in good shape. The case, trimmed to length and sized, and perhaps inside reamed or outside turned, whatever is necessary. As well, a larger rim (.573" ring) can be installed and sweated on(soldered) for BP loads. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Quote: Got to think of it...why not just re-chamber to .450 Bushmaster...lol |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Marrakal - That rifle is the reason I started looking for Snider carbines, especially by JC & A Lord One of the best I have seen, I particularly like it for being "in the white" TH44 |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
That one, the .450 Bushmaster is too small in dia., so there would be no re-chamber. .450 Bushmaster Neck diameter .4800 in (12.19 mm)[1] Base diameter .5000 in (12.70 mm)[1] Rim diameter .473 in (12.0 mm)[1] |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Mistakes were made...by me!!. The gun is in .380Rook. Don`t ask how I couldn`t tell the difference between a .450" and a .362" caliber hole in a barrel. The good thing is I have a bulletmold to make heeled bullets in this caliber. I had given up to shoot it if the gun was in .450 No1 Eley as too much hazzle was involved...but a.380 Rook is much easier to make ammo for. I have cleaned the barrel and the rifling is like new cut. I will post pictures later this week. This little rifle is the dantiest I`ve ever had. The barrel is 25" long and the gun weighes maybe 4 ibs only |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
That's good! |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
I am in for more surprises. I have a .38 short colt cartridge which ought to fit well enough but not so. It drops into the chamber past extractor. The rim is too small. Its very difficult to measure extractorrim, but it looks like the rimdiameter is 12mm. The caliber at muzzle is 9,4mm and with this I suspect the Snider is a .360 2¼ express. I have a friend sending me a .360 2¼ case. A Snider in .360 2¼" is new to me. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
Amazing. I take it this means the case is a necked case - perhaps a .444 Marlin case might work as it is also 2 1/4" in length? Rim dia. is listed as 13.1mm (.514"). Body .4706" at the base (11.95 mm) The rimmed 7x57 as well should be about the same size as the .444 Marlin. Or is this too large in dia. |
||||||||
|
|
|||||||
chamber cast time |