| Tatume |
| (.400 member) |
| 04/04/08 01:24 AM |
Best deer cartridge?
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Hello Folks,
For years I’ve thought about the best “all around” cartridge. But, most of my hunting is for deer, so lately I’ve been thinking about what should be the best specialty cartridge for deer. The small-caliber bullets work. High velocity certainly improves trajectory, but only under the most extraordinary circumstances would I shoot beyond 200 yards.
I’ve come to the conclusion that the most important characteristic to me is immediate incapacitation. Trailing animals can be difficult for me (for physical reasons), so if I can drop them in their tracks it is a great benefit. Recently I have been shooting 300 gr 45 caliber bullets at 2500 fps, and find that this gives the desired effect. I have two such rifles, a modern (smokeless) muzzleloader, and a Ruger #1 458 Win Mag.
My thoughts now turn to the weight and recoil of these two rifles. I’m considering my 375 H&H Ruger #1 loaded to fire a 180 gr Speer or a 200 gr Sierra bullet at 2700 - 2800 fps. This is at the very bottom of what the loading manuals recommend, and actually I’d like to get slower. But, this will do. My #1 375 Tropical is almost two pounds lighter than my #1 458 Tropical, and it’s fitted with a very nice recoil pad. I’m thinking that Paul Mathews may have been right all along; the 375 H&H may be the ideal deer cartridge.
What are your thoughts?
Take care, Tom
| JabaliHunter |
| (.400 member) |
| 04/04/08 02:30 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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This is an interesting twist on deer cartidges
You clearly like the Ruger No1 and I am assuming that the reason for the 200grain bulets is for expansion on lighter animals. There are loads of cartridges to choose from, but here are a couple that could be worth considering:
If you handload, what about an improved .303 and 215 grain bullets?
If you want heavier bullets and even if you don't handload, what about the 9.3x74R and 250 grain bullets? These expand well and would knock down deer hard. Its a VERY popular cartridge in Europe for deer and boar.
Both would be great in a falling block, but you might have to get custom barrels.
| hoppdoc |
| (.400 member) |
| 04/04/08 05:42 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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If you want a deer "stopper" and don't want to walk far after you shoot them--consider a Federal 12 gauge sabot slug. The slug is a Barnes copper hollowpoint and mushrooms open for really devastating results.Hit them right and its like hitting them with a hammer!!
I'm thinking this would also make a h*lluva Leopard shell if a SXS shotty was used.And your good to 100+yds with a rifled barrel!!
| 9.3x57 |
| (.450 member) |
| 04/04/08 06:12 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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Immediate incapacitation.
If that is the goal, I don't know the answer, at least I'm not sure.
Some years ago I corresponded with Paul Matthews a bit. Very nice fellow and I have a couple of his books. He favored the .375 as you say and the .45-70, two cartridges I like also.
I used the .375 for years and shot quite a few deer with it. Truth is though, I agree more with Finn Aagaard who said he didn't notice the .375 made any quicker kills than many smaller cartridges on smaller plains game.
Deer I shot with the .375 ran when hit in the lungs and dropped at the shot when hit in the spine, just like the results when hit with many other cartridges I've used on them.
I mostly used 300 grain Hornadys and had no complaints, but a lighter bullet like you suggest might have actually been a quicker killer.
The .45-70 is intriguing, as maybe it was just me, but I found it to be a very fast stopper with my Lee 402 grain hollow Point cast bullet. I didn't shoot a lot of deer with that load, and I did shoot a bear and a couple range cattle, too. It was extremely effective at the short ranges I used it at.
I've shot whitetails with the 6.5x55, .300 Savage, .30-06, 7x57, .348 Winchester, .45-70, .375 H&H, 7.62x39, 9.3x57, and maybe one or two more. I can't say I saw a noticeable killing "SPEED" difference in any of them. Never shot a deer with a shotgun.
Tatume, my brother swears by the .45-70 with 300 grain HP's, and that is a "fast" combination to be sure, so I imagine your .45/300/2500 must be an absolute bomb on them!
| CowboyCS |
| (.333 member) |
| 04/04/08 08:44 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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I've always hunted deer with my 270 win handloaded with nosler partitions. It's a pre 64 model 70 and I'm more familiar with this particular rifle than any other I own. I've shot more than 40 deer and probably at least that many antelope with it and never had one go more than about 4 steps on me before tipping over. .270 Winchester - just my opinion and worth what you paid for it.
C
| AspenHill |
| (Sponsor) |
| 05/04/08 09:15 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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My deer medicine:
.45 cal muzzleloader
.30-06
100 Grain broadhead
| DarylS |
| (.700 member) |
| 05/04/08 10:29 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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If you load the .458 to the 2,400fps with a 405gr. RP or WW 405gr. bullet and shoot a deer right on the diaphram, you can walk up to where it was standing, place the rifle's sling over one shoulder, stick your arm though the hole and sling the deer over the other. It's aleady gutted as well.
| Ripp |
| (.577 member) |
| 05/04/08 10:53 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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Isn't a 458 a bit excessive for deer? Just asking...but out here, while the shots tend to be farther..you can still drop them in their tracks with placement versus size of bore..seems as though the high shoulder shot works quite well and drops them immediately in their tracks--agree with the above post--270 or 280 is more than adequate on deer..if shot placement is correctly done.
As to favorites for deer..
257 Weatherby caliber
280
100 gr broadhead---per Aspenhill
Ripp
| szihn |
| (.400 member) |
| 05/04/08 11:09 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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I am with CowboyCS on this one.
I have killed a LOT of deer and antelope. Bigger game too, but on deer and antelope I have done it with quite a few rifles and handguns and 4 times with arrows too. The smallest caliber I ever killed a deer with was a 22 WMR and the largest was a 62 caliber Jaeger rifle. The most powderful was the 458.
I have used 22 WMR, 22-250, 25-06, 6.5 Swede, 7mm Mauser, 6.8 SPC, 270 winchester, 30-30, 308 Win, 30-40 Kraig, 348 Winchester, 303 British, 300 Savage, 30-06, 300H&H, 8mm Mauser, 9X56 Mannlicher, 35 Remington, 338-06, 375H&H, 458 Winchester, 45-70, 50-140 sharps, 357 magnum, 44 magnum, 45 auto, 45 colt, 454 Casull, 50 caliber muzzleloader, 54 caliber muzzleloader, 58 caliber muzzleloader 62 caliber muzzleloader and some heavy arrows with 2 and 3 blade broadheads from resurvey bows and a longbow.
For the pure "electric death effect", I have to say the 270 is on the top of the heap. There are some that seemed to work about as well, but nothing I have ever shot (or seen shot) works better.
| hoppdoc |
| (.400 member) |
| 05/04/08 11:55 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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Best Deer cartridge??
Easy--What ever floats your boat!!
Deer and light boned and don't take much to put them down--I have shot many,many deer with various cartridges as have most of those on this forum and all work within the right circumstances.
The one I take the most?? Probably a 243 or 270 for open places,30-30 short barreled TContender for tight dense places and a 7 mm mag for long range shooting--
Or-try shooting a deer with a slug gun--the impact noted is impressive!!
| Marrakai |
| (.416 member) |
| 05/04/08 12:53 PM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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Isn't there a www.bestdeercartridge.com somewhere...?
It's an 8-page list....
| gatsby |
| (.375 member) |
| 05/04/08 01:57 PM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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In the west 270 winchester, hands down.
| reflex264 |
| (.275 member) |
| 09/06/08 03:01 PM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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For my long shots .264 Win Mag. I hunt bean fields and nothing works better. For shots out to 300 yards I generaly carry a 45-70,.444 or .450 levergun. I use everything in between. reflex264
| Nakihunter |
| (.375 member) |
| 09/06/08 03:40 PM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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My favourites over the years have been
6.5X55 with 125gr Nosler Part to match a 270 Win, 140 gr to match a 7X57 & 160gr RN to exceed all the above.
I now use a 7mm08 - in a light Kimber Montana - a perfect solution out to 350 meters.
My other favourite was a Mod70 Win in 358 Win with 20 inch barrel & 225gr Sierras. It dropped deer in their tracks & you could eat to the hole! I still regret having sold the rifle.
| bonanza |
| (.400 member) |
| 09/06/08 10:27 PM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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I know the worst is the 25-06.
"Deer" is very nebulous. I've seen deer from 30 feet to 300 yards, 90 Lbs to 200 Lbs. I've seen them from all angles.
I don't own one, but on paper ballistics favor the .35 whelen, especially for monster mullies.
| 500grains |
| (.416 member) |
| 10/06/08 12:41 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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I have shot mule deer out to 475 yards. For that type of situation I prefer a magnum such as 7mm STW, 7mm Rem Mag, 300 Win Mag.
For shots at mule deer, out to 350 yards, I like a 270 Win with 130 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips or 30-06 with 165 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips.
For those teeny tiny whitetails in the eastern U.S., I prefer .308 Win with 150 grain Speer. However, good results are also obtained with 7x57 Mauser with 140 grain bullets or even 6mm Remington with 85 grain Nosler Partitons.
I have had better luck with Nosler Ballistic Tips than with Nosler Partitions for everything from .270 on up.
Also, I have seen unsatisfactory results with 25-06 and .264. Probably wrong bullet choice.
| DarylS |
| (.700 member) |
| 10/06/08 09:55 AM |
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Re: Best deer cartridge?
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I've a friend here in town, who uses his .25/06 for elk almost every year. He has a huge collection of rifles of all calibres from the .223 to the .458 I used to own. In between are .243, 6.5x68, .270, 7mm Mauser, .280 Rem, .308, 7.5x55 Schmidt Rubin, 8x68S, .325 Federal, 8x68S, .338WM, .358 Winchester, .350 RM, 9.5x68 and .375H&H, yet he uses the .25/06 more times than not. To date, most of his elk have been on the far side of 300 meters. While I most certainly would use something else, almost anything larger, he dearly loves the .25/06 for elk. I would not trust most hunters to use this round, but for him, he could probably use the .223 and still get the first elk he shoots at, every year without fai. I have never seen a game shot with his accuracy and expertise.
: I do find it interesting that he mostly uses the .338 or .375, the two calibres he usually took for guiding backup. Now he takes my .458 for that duty.