ruffcountry
(.300 member)
27/12/17 02:40 PM
Doubles with hammers

I recently came across a double with hammers in a caliber quite suitable for dangerous game (480 gr. bullets @ 2150 fps) . My questions to fellow members are , have you or would you use a hammer gun on dangerous game ?
This rile is just a little out of my price range but I was curious if somehow I was able to afford it , would it be appropriate to take on a dangerous game hunt . In other words , would a professional hunter frown if I showed up to hunt cape buffalo with a double hammer rifle ?


cordite
(.333 member)
28/12/17 02:40 AM
Re: Doubles with hammers

It was perfectly suited for many years so why would it not be suitable now? Your professional hunter might frown because it could be something new to them. That doesn't make it unsuitable.

Given a good rifle, the key is practice. You have to learn to operate the rifle and get it ingrained into your muscle memory so it becomes automatic in stressful situations. I don't view them as being less safe than a hammerless gun but you need to know what you are doing. Seeing you handle and shoot the rifle well will turn frowns into smiles.


DarylS
(.700 member)
28/12/17 03:53 AM
Re: Doubles with hammers

I hunt in dangerous game country with a single shot hammer rifle. Jack Lott hunted Cape buff with a hammer .577. many hunters before him and likely after him have as well.
I see no problem with what sounds like a .450 Nitro double hammer gun, after all, "a rifle without hammers is like a spaniel without ears", to quote Edward VII.


3DogMike
(.400 member)
28/12/17 07:02 AM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Daryl,
Funny, you beat me to it. I was about to mention Jack Lott and his .577
http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=294716&an=0&page=0#Post294716
Add in the guys like Ray Meyer, Cal Pappas and more that have collected and hunted with vintage hammer double rifles. Lott in his various writings mentions quite a few names from the 1950’s and 1960’s.

PH’s in the 1870’s to early 1900’s saw a lot of dangerous game killed with hammer rifles.....because that is what they had. Maybe these days a PH would have to see a guy use one to become comfortable with the idea?

Me? I hunt Jack Rabbits with hammer double rifles. Are they dangerous? Well ask the Knights in Monty Python “Search for the Holy Grail” about the ferocity of the “killer rabbit”.
- Mike


Rockdoc
(.400 member)
28/12/17 02:03 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Rabbits!

Huh, you’ll be stuffed without the Holy Handgrenade of Antioch!


Sarg
(.400 member)
28/12/17 02:15 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

I wouldnt be worried if you turned up with a double hammer gun with .450NE power & most won't, be better if it was a TLH Top Lever Hammered but dont suppose it is !

Rothhammer1
(.400 member)
28/12/17 04:29 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Quote:

Rabbits!

Huh, you’ll be stuffed without the Holy Handgrenade of Antioch!








"Four shalt thou not count, nor either count thou two, excepting that thou then proceed to three. Five is right out."


ruffcountry
(.300 member)
01/01/18 01:15 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Yes it would be a top lever and Im still trying to figure out any way to come up with the funds to buy it .

As for rabbits , Ive often thought that a walk in west texas shooting at jack rabbit with a double rifle would be great fun and as good of practice you could get .


calpappas
(.275 member)
01/01/18 09:07 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

If you'd like, email me the link and I'l be pleased to look at this double and offer my opinion as to value, quality, etc.
I'm at <pappas@mtaonline.net>

If any PH frowns on the use of a hammer double is is probably just jealous and a bit envious he hutns with a POS turn bolt in the $500 range. It's your hunt, your money, your memories, so do as you wish. Nothing is better than using a vintage double in Africa (or anywhere else for that matter).

Good luck.
Cal


Sarg
(.400 member)
02/01/18 05:57 AM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Quote:

If any PH frowns on the use of a hammer double is is probably just jealous and a bit envious he hutns with a POS turn bolt in the $500 range. It's your hunt, your money, your memories, so do as you wish. Nothing is better than using a vintage double in Africa (or anywhere else for that matter).

Good luck.
Cal




What a weird thing to say, other than the cheap bolt gun, which would be true of most African PH,s (not outfitters) as we get like $75 a day & expected to supply Bakkie with POS turn bolt rifle, which we need to fix all the fuck up's our closed eared hunters start !


ruffcountry
(.300 member)
02/01/18 06:15 AM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Quote:

If you'd like, email me the link and I'l be pleased to look at this double and offer my opinion as to value, quality, etc.
I'm at <pappas@mtaonline.net>

Good luck.
Cal





Thank You , Sir .


DarylS
(.700 member)
02/01/18 06:20 AM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Quote:

Yes it would be a top lever and Im still trying to figure out any way to come up with the funds to buy it .

As for rabbits , Ive often thought that a walk in west texas shooting at jack rabbit with a double rifle would be great fun and as good of practice you could get .




I am planning on doing that in a couple years, somewhere around Yuma, with either a PCP .25 Air Rifle, or a flintlock - (quite likely the flinter).


Rothhammer1
(.400 member)
02/01/18 01:59 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Quote:

As for rabbits ,




I am planning on doing that in a couple years, somewhere around Yuma, with either a PCP .25 Air Rifle, or a flintlock - (quite likely the flinter).




I haven't done that around Yuma, but there were plenty of jacks (covered with ticks) in Northern Arizona that I used to get after. If you're going to Yuma in the summer, I hope you like heat.

Their average high from June through September is in excess of 100. The 'net shows a record high of 124f (51c) in 1995. Their winters are mild with a record low of 21f in January of '07.


DarylS
(.700 member)
02/01/18 03:19 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Late October through mid November. Last Dec. 8th, or thereabouts, it was 21F in William's, Arizona - a bit brisk, but still warmer than at home.

Rothhammer1
(.400 member)
02/01/18 08:38 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Quote:

Late October through mid November. Last Dec. 8th, or thereabouts, it was 21F in William's, Arizona - a bit brisk, but still warmer than at home.




Williams is purrty (unless it's changed a lot in the past decade). There are some rather nice meadows and forested areas there with abundant elk.

I lived in Northern AZ for some years and worked outdoors all over the Navajo and Hopi 'Rez' and along the Mogollon rim into the White Mountains (and everywhere between).

A few years ago, some fool on the 'net (From Pennsylvania) very insistently told me that it "never freezes in Arizona". His "trusted sources" had told him so and that was that. When I told him of Arizona Ski resorts, snow, iced roads, frozen pipes, he insisted that I was lying.

Granted, it wasn't Minnesota or anything. Below zero fahrenheit was rare, snow seldom deeper than 18" or so unless you're really 'up in it'.


ruffcountry
(.300 member)
03/01/18 02:37 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Quote:



A few years ago, some fool on the 'net (From Pennsylvania) very insistently told me that it "never freezes in Arizona".







Ha Ha Ha . Maybe someone should tell the ice fishers at Luna Lake .


ruffcountry
(.300 member)
03/01/18 02:56 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Quote:

Late October through mid November. Last Dec. 8th, or thereabouts, it was 21F in William's, Arizona - a bit brisk, but still warmer than at home.




Daryl , if your gonna be there that time of year then you should take your "flinter" after a coues deer . I find them quite challenging and a very enjoyable hunt .let me know if you want more info , ive been chasin them for years .


Rothhammer1
(.400 member)
03/01/18 04:10 PM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Quote:

Quote:



A few years ago, some fool on the 'net (From Pennsylvania) very insistently told me that it "never freezes in Arizona".







Ha Ha Ha . Maybe someone should tell the ice fishers at Luna Lake .




Alpine, AZ was part of my regular route for a few years. They're called the 'White Mountains' for a reason!

Naaaaah, it never freezes in Arizona!


DarylS
(.700 member)
04/01/18 05:23 AM
Re: Doubles with hammers

Quote:

Quote:

Late October through mid November. Last Dec. 8th, or thereabouts, it was 21F in William's, Arizona - a bit brisk, but still warmer than at home.




Daryl , if your gonna be there that time of year then you should take your "flinter" after a coues deer . I find them quite challenging and a very enjoyable hunt .let me know if you want more info , ive been chasin them for years .




Seems to me, all the larger game requires limited entry tags - not going to happen for me, I expect.


Bonde
(.333 member)
08/01/18 06:39 AM
Re: Doubles with hammers

I would not hesitate to bring a hammer double on B5 hunt. They are, with practice, every bit as fast as a Krieghoff or Blaser, and are on top of that absolutely silent if you hold in the trigger as you cock it.
I don´t fint it less safe than a regular double. It doesn´t become more unsafe just because you see the hammers??

In a matter of fact, I will actually do exactly that in october/november 2018!

I have roughly booked a tuskless elephant hunt, and would like to have a go at a lioness if time (and money) permits. Staying for 10 days in Zimbabwe. Area not decided just yet - letting the PH sort something out.

The rifle I am bringing along is a 1908 W J Jeffery hammer toplever in .400 3" 55grs tropical load .411" bores.
Has aquired some .410" Hydros that will be tested, along with 400 grs woodleighs soft.

Hopefully I will use it on both the elephant and the lioness! Both beeing traditional tracking hunts, I reckon it will be the adventure of a lifetime!

Bringing a Kimber M89 BGR in .375H&H as a second gun, for the lioness if I can´t get close enough with the double, and for some plains game.


Claydog
(.375 member)
08/01/18 10:05 AM
Re: Doubles with hammers

I think a PH will be much more concerned in a persons ability to carry a heavy double over long distances and shoot it well thereafter as opposed to whether it has external hammers or not.


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