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Hello After looking at the gorgeous "bellies" posted by Curl, I wondered if your DR's are collector items or if you take them out into the hunting arena? If you take them hunting, what do you hunt and where? Is there a problem taking them into and out of Africa? I am curious, as the DR would seem to be perfect for hunting BIG game where you might need a second shot in a hurry! Then, these are thoughts from a wife married to a mad DR owner, hunter, fisherman, etc. I have never hunted myself, so I apologize if I have asked silly questions. Married into the business, and enjoying it! Laura alexbeer.com PS-REally like this site! |
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Hi Alex, I hunted big game for the first time last September at age 62 when I hunted Buffalo in the Northern Territory with Australian Buffalo Hunters, Graham Williams.. I took my Chapuis "Brousse" in .375 which performed beautifuly with the Federal 300 gn TSX Cape Shock Ammunition and yes, the second shot puts them down for keeps. I flew by Qantas after getting their "Letter of Authority" for carrying Dangerous Goods and was a Breeze. I now have a renewed letter to fly with them for when I go to Africa which will hopefully be in May 2009. I have been advised that it is fairly straight forward but have a "Meet and Greet" guy organised at JoBerg Airport that does all of the paperwork on the ground. This is in addition to the paperwork provided by the hunting outfitter. There are no silly questions, only answers you do not know of. Cheers for now. |
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Hello, Alex: I hunt with my doubles from several years ago. Strictly, my first double, a Merkel in 9,3x74R, was adquired with that purpose. Later I bought a Francotte in 450 BPE and it too has gone hunting, and a great experience it was. It is wonderful returning to its intended use a rifle of 85 years. It is also wonderful the face of your hunting buddies when they realize your old double still works fine! In Spain, where I live, we have not dangerous hunt; but in our driven hunts of boar and stag, when one boar (or more than one) running ahead of dogs crosses a "cortadero" (a 20 yard opening in the bush), the DR two shots are really handy! Use your doubles, they are very practical tools! Antonio Molins, Spain. |
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Hunt with doubles pretty-much exclusively, except for official cull-hunts where a scoped 6.5 to .308 is mandated. Check the hunting page of my web-site. Doubles are just so damn correct for hunting boar and buff in the Australian tropics. Assume similar for Africa, both plains game and DG, but yet to embibe! |
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Hunt with a DR? What else is there? If you ain't hunting with a DR, you just ain't hunting! Curl |
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Of course. Why have them if you can't hunt with them. Currently my favourites are 303, a 9.3x74R and a 450/400. They are the most practical for what I do now. I have used my Faunetta for Grouse and Chukars but no game. I have also used my 10 bore Paradox for Turkey, Geese and a couple of feral pigs. An 8 Bore for two whitetail Does. I also have a few bigger rifles tucked away that I have used in the past and, maybe, will again one day. |
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Cap: Love those camouflage suspenders. I hear bears are color blind. Now, I can't speak for their taste in attire, but good thing you shot him before he could offer an opinion. Dave |
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Hunting is the reason I bought mine.I got it several months before going to Zimbabwe and shot most every weekend before we left.I am in the process of looking for another good deal on an African hunt now because my rifle want to go back after other game. |
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I collect guns and shoot a lot, but have not been big game hunting yet. I would love to go sometime if work schedule and $$$ permit. |
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I have been hunting since I was six with the game and rifle size growing as I did. No doubles in the safe yet. The $$$ means are just coming now for such high end guns. I think Iwant to hang around here and learn a bit before I buy. Landy |
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Gentlemen, I think Laura Beer is asking the question! Laura, I'm not a collector at all. All my firearms are for hunting. Except I have more than I need for just simple hunting. I tend to prefer my rifles including doubles to be plainer and simpler, as I am not the kindest person to them and believe a tool exists to be used, not babied. My Jeffery .450 No.2 Nitro Express, "Zabardast", has been used on a variety of game, including elephant, water buffalo, donkeys, boar, warthog, fallow deer, scrub bulls, among other game. Oops forgot the last beast to fall to "Zabardast", banteng - photo added above. My Tikka/Valmet 9.3x74R has been used on a water buff cull, scrub bulls, boar, warthogs, deer, donkeys, wild horses, and some other game. My .58 Black powder DR has to yet be blooded. *** If I was a rich man I would have an extensive collection as well. |
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Gentlemen, Thanks so much for your replies. I am trying to learn as much as possible about rifles and hunting, seeing as I married Alex, a custom rifle maker and a keen hunter. So I appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions. Nitrox, will we see you at the Shot Expo? We are in booth 34 and will be running a Special Expo Package! Sincerely, Laura alexbeer.com |
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Laura-- Welcome to the website---great folks here!!!Alot of Double owners and prospective owners as well!! Doubles are great guns to hunt with--I have a Merkel but haven't bloodied it as yet--Maybe soon on a pig hunt!! Would love to see your guns under construction and the finished product! Cheers |
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I have always been enamored with double rifles, and have collected them since the age of 21, and I'm now 71 yrs old! I collect any firearm with more than one barrel, but always with the idea of what I can hunt with them! I hunt everything from jackrabbit to Cape Buffalo, and back friends on Elephant, with double rifles of one chambering or another from 22 Hornet, to 577NE! I see no reason to own a gun unless there is a purpose for it beyond self defense, or hunting! The double rifle is the only firearm in my view that started life as a hunting rifle! All others long, or short, were origenally designed for self defense, or warfare! Regardless of the dressing on a double rifle, it is still a hunter on the inside, and that is what I use mine for! Welcome here! and though your company is far away from my Texas home, most of my rifles have come from places just as far away! Hunters, in Texas, or OZ, are brother, and sisters under the skin, and it makes little difference, where they come from, or the language they speek, and the common thread is the tools,and the animals, in this case the double rifle, and big game! |
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Welcome to the site..and YES...I do hunt with mine--primarily use it in Africa and plan to use it again for elephant...using a W/R .470... Ripp |
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Use them every chance you get. |
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Oh Yes |
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Great stuff, John! I don't even own a double but after looking at this hombre wadin' out in that slush I want one real bad, and a plane ticket and a seat on the mule to wherever this hunt took place... |
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Hello gentlemen Thank you so much for the replies and the photos! I am really enjoying this site. I wake up in the morning and look forward with much excitement to who has posted what. I really appreciate what Mac from Texas said... Quote: To me that sums up the elegance and tradition of the DR. Plus I thank you for your lovely welcome. I am liking you gentlemen more and more every day. Laura alexbeer.com |
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Viewing these great photos of doubles and the wide variety of game taken with them, I'm having to review my thoughts on doubles. To me, they've always represented the ideal stopper for all game at close range and the big bores fascinate me the most. Probably a result of reading a lot of Africana! However, the thought of a lighter double is fast beginning to appeal to me for general hunting and I have a pleasant but nasty feeling where this is going! So much for my bank balance! Alex and Laura, we are going to have a chat at the SHOT Show...a big chat! |
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Doubles can be great for the dangerous Klipspringer... |
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Quote: Ha, you will have to speak to Matt Graham whom hunts at Gan Gan in Arnhemland. I am sure he could find you some wetlands to wade in. It was a fun hunt, the bull was shot at very close range with Matt and I in up to our thighs at less than 20 yards away in a thin strip of paperbarks about a 100 to 200 metres from shore. The bull was zig zagging through the swamp feeding on succulent shoots and I waited until he turned towards shore before shooting, in case he made a run for the deeper water behind in the photo. Story here. Thanks for the modified photo. I may use that! I might have to modify the banteng one in a similar way to remove from hot red face in that photo. |
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Great hunt, John. You guys keep working on me and my budget and that budget might be a little tighter... BTW: I had no idea banteng were such a beautiful animal. Really stunning coat and color scheme. |
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That's nice Heym you got there good buddy ! Reg lapua |
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While a double is fun to shoot and the loading for it sometimes makes me feels like a mad scientist, it's the joy of taking it to the field on a fun hunt that brings the most satisfaction. While my .470 is overkill for the things I hunt here at home, I have used it some on deer that I hunt at my farm. But it's in Africa that the gun feels at home, and I'm looking forward to taking there again in 3 months. Tanzania 2005 |
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I agree. I continue to use my .450 no.2 double on whitetails and wild hogs here at home. |
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Hello Spring Great photo! I am really enjoying seeing all these terrains and Doubles, and game and hunters! Sometimes it can feel it bit isolated here in Tasmania, so it gladens our hearts to hear that hunting is still alive in the core of mens hearts. So again, Thank you all for your photos and stories. Spring, what sort of Double do you have and how long have you had it? Curious, Laura alexbeer.com |
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A hunt that a big double rifle is ideal for. |
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"..... those great recounts of Selous, Burton, the Muirs in Nyasaland, even Livingstone, their travels into the vastness of an uncharted continent after the riches of ivory. They still linger in our memories and provoke that excitement we all feel when we think of Africa, toting a double rifle over your shoulder and taking on a beast the size of a London bus." - Pete Swanepoel jnr |
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Oz hunter, nice mate, very nice!!!!! cheers Chris |
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Quote: Laura, That pic is one with my best hunting buddy, my son. He's about to graduate from college and we're looking forward to our upcoming September hunt in the Selous where we'll chase around a bunch of critters again. As for my gun, it's a Beretta 455 and I've had it for 4 years. It's a great shooting gun and I enjoy shooting it at 100 yards as much as the 50 at which it was regulated. |
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Hello Spring Thanks for the reply. Again I am encouraged -that a son is following in his father's footsteps into the wild! We have 2 sons of our own that we hope will one day take up the sport with keen interest. Wow Ozhunter what a beast! Just how many hunts have you been on and where? Please share some stories. Hopeful, Laura alexbeer.com |
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Great Photo Adam, you are a true Aussie Hunter. |
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Ozhunter, Very impressed with with your pictures!, What rifle did you use? steve |
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Adam Again great how you dropped your ele perfectly for the cameraman. |
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...or rolled it upright with a vehicle (tyre tracks?). Either way, great photo and well worth the effort. |
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yep just a bit smaller then Ozhunters best regards peter |
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Yes Laura,we do hunt with our doubles. The regular forum members have all seen this video of my elephant in Zimbabwe but you may not have. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCpa8OQRosM#GU5U2spHI_4 |
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Hi Laura I hunt with mine - nothing exotic so far - just the common aussie stuff - pigs, brumbies & scrub bulls so far. Here are some photos. Krieghoff 9.3x74 Searcy De Luxe .470 Krieghoff again. Searcy again. Looking forward to seeing more photos of your work and hope to visit next time in Tassy. Cheers. GG |
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A few more pics. This time with my Valmet in 9.3x74R. From this thread - "Mad Cow" Cull |
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Hello Peter What type of "deer" is that? Is it from your homeland? Thanks for the photo. What is your Double rifle? Cheers, Laura alexbeer.com |
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Hi Wombat Thanks for the post, I will watch it soon. I am about at my download limit. I'll let you know when I see it. What dort of Double do you have? Laura alexbeer.com |
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Hello GG, Thanks for the great photos! Looks like a top hunting spot. Is it your own land? How long have you had your Doubles? We would love to give you a feed next time your're in Tassie and talk hunting! Long live the honour, the tradition, the timelessness of the stalk, Laura alexbeer.com |
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Quote: |
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G'day John, Thanks for the great photos! So you found that caliber has adequate stopping power? How many shots to take her down? Curious, Laura alexbeer.com |
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Quote: hi laura the dbl. rifle is described here: http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=86079&an=0&page=0#Post86079 and the deer is a roe deer, the hunt is described here: http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=105003&an=0&page=0#Post105003 best regards peter |
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Thanks Bighammer! Chuffed, Laura alexbeer.com |
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Hi Laura I've had these 2 doubles for a couple of years now. The areas I hunt are properties around where I live here in Nth Qld. Very seasonal up here which means the hunting season is only fairly short. The wet season usually starts around Dec and finishes in April. Then I usually wait until the water dries up and the grass dies back or is burned off so the actual hunting season is from about August to Dec. Best time is Oct/Nov just before the rains come as the ferals are usually not too far from what water is available. Thanks for the offer of a feed and a look at Alex's work. Jennie and I hope to come down maybe next year or the year after. Looking forward to seeing some more photos of your doubles. Cheers. GG |
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Quote: I shot fourteen water buffalo on that trip with that rifle. Most took one to three shots to kill or keep down. Most dropped on first shot, but may have required one or two more shots to keep down. Cows and smaller bulls only. Pigs dropped well of course. As did horses. The scrub bull refused to drop or die. Tough old bugger. The donkey was the worst and as usual took more than expected to get it to drop. 9.3x74R did well. It is a great brush and driven medium game calibre, perfect for sambar. Also makes a not too bad minimum of buffalo and the like. |
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Will you please stop posting a picture of your rifle. I might do something foolish! |
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Just to bring this post back up . |
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ozhunter I couldn't have picked a better photo LOL !!! Top stuff. |
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Trying to attach a photo.Hope this one works, Laura. - Paul [image]http://s561.photobucket.com/albums/ss55/paul_miles/?action=view¤t=301.jpg[/image] |
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Sorry, I was hoping that pic would open up like everyone else's, instead of just taking us to Photobucket. John, any chance of a tutorial for luddites without websites on how to do that? - Paul |
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Paul's Cape Buffalo taken from the Northern Mozambique province of Cabo Delgado . |
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Paul, looks like a Heym PH in 450/400? NitroEx's "Lapua" has one of these. |
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Very nice!!! Some very nice trophies here. |
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Shot my last two moose with my 9,3x74R Chapuis. First one was about 70 yards away and second was a lasered 187 yards. Both were shot off hand with factory irons. If it doesnt make a good hunting rifle then I see no point in owning one. |
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Yes, Ozhunter, I suspect Lapua got the first Heym 450/.400 into Australia and mine might be the second. The SN makes it look as though they had only made 22 Mod 88s of any calibre at the time - but I guess they have changed the sequence, somehow. - Paul |
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This year buffalo, eland, zebra and warthog with doubles. Next year hopefully elephant! Charls |
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An old toothy Boar with the 470 |
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.303 British .450 #2 NE .54 x 10 gauge percussion cape gun |
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My first hunt after a 25 year lay-off from hunting was done with my 45-70 double. I don't think that I would want to hunt with anything but a double now. |
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BTTT |
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How does the computer challenged put photos here? I have taken water buffalo, 2 cape buffalo, leopard, lion, hippo, croc, sable, a dozen plains game and Alaska game with .450-400, .450 no 2, .600, and also a .500 bpe and a 12-bore ball and shot gun. I sold my Winchester collection with no regrets! Cheers, Cal |
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Hello Cal, Please e-mail them to me at kamdarmehul (at) gmail. Glad to post pictures for any members anytime. Good hunting! |
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Posted before but it disappeared as I screwed up my photobucket, here it is again, nice Hippo above by the way |
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Warthog with the Valmet 9.3x74R. |
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Another buffalo Graham Williams and I. Graham from Australian Buffalo Hunters. Wal and Graham. Wal borrowed my .450 to finish off this scrub bull. My red scrub bull, with the .450. This bull after being hit with a raking shot with a 480 gr soft point, maybe too much gut to penetrate, turned, received the second barrel in the lungs, then came down the hill looking for me. A reload behind a tree then the third, a cloud of bloody mist and he was down. Second buff of the hunt. |
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A couple of tuskless cow elephant from 2006. Small cow with part of trunk cut off from a snare. A cull. Shaun Buffee and staff. Number 2 several days later. Paul Frodsham and staff from Nengasha Safaris. Jeffery in .450 No.2 NE used and 480 gr Woodleigh FMJs |
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More photos please! |
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That's a huge bushbuck! |
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A Stag taken at 100m after a great stalk with a lovely RIGBY .350. Rolled him with two shots to the chest |
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Zambezi Lady taken with my Gibbs 450 |
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Fantastic thread, keep them coming. I hope to post some game taken with my new 470 soon! |
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Axis/chital doe with Alex Henry 500BPE at 100 odd yards. |
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Sabatti 450NE Warthog at 5 meters and Zebra at 92 meters. It is very well regulated I am very happy with my double. |
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The other day; |
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The mouse that roared, my A.H 360- 2 1/4" |
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Bravo! I like that. I need to have a good hunt with my Rigby of the same caliber. Curl |
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Two Bulls with a 470NE; |
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Taken yesterday at Northern Mozambique with a Verney-Carron 470NE; |
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Quote: What a beauty! Claws marks at the hind end? Have a great hunt. Cheers, Chris |
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My first DR hunt was for Wild Boar, I used a Sabatti 9.3x74r. I managed to get inside of 30m for a head on shot. The bullet crossed the whole length and was found just under the skin of the ham. The Pig spun 180 degrees and was DRT. I took a 470 Merkel to Afrika and missed an amazingly close shot on a Wart Hog because I expected him to pop out further away and had the sight set for 100m. It was kinda fun watching that pig scatter though... Just a couple months ago I used a Double 10ga Bore Gun for a Wild Boar on a drive hunt. My freezer is full of some of the best pork Ive ever had. |
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Quote: Some good shooting with a double rifle with open sights. |
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Quote: Well done Adam. That photo needs to be added to the scrum cap buffalo thread - the one mentioned the magazine contest. Why not send it to the magazine too. A old warrior with lots of scars. BTW what is the hole in the right horn? Is it an old bullet hole? Good luck on the rest of your Mozambique safari and trip. Lucky bastard. |
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Quote: eh... ...eh...eish....Adam that one hurts...Weidmannsheil! |
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On the trail of Buffalo; |
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A day before Adam got the scrum cap. We tracked the old bull several days and bumped him a time or two. Glad Adam got 'em |
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Best Buffalo I have seen in a long time !!!!! Congrats on a great trophy . Robert |
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Rifle/cartridge? |
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Yes |
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Quote:Quote: Yes, There are a lot of Lion in the area. |
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Quote: It was a pleasure meeting you for that short time and appreciate the Email. It actually did take three days to get that bull so not as fast as two years earlier. Regards, Adam |
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Quote: Rigby sidelock .500 NE. Woodleigh 570 gn solids. Actually jumped 5 Durga boys after tracking buffalo for 12 days. A lot of water and dry leaves in the jess. Tough hunting. BTW, saw the biggest buffalo I have ever seen in a herd. Rounds entered right hip and ended up at left shoulder. Glad we had the horsepower. |
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Thanks Andy, and the same to you. Glad you got that wily 'ol buff. Thanks for letting us know his est. age I got within about 100 yards of him and only saw him briefly. You did one heck of a job collecting him. BZ |
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umm no i dont, after putting a deposit on it, and being told the wait would be 6 -8 months for it to be completed ,its now 20 months and still not ready, then, however long it takes............... to get the Export Permit ,customs etc hmmmmmmmm |
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Yes, I do hunt with mine. |
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Quite a hole above it's left eye. That's quite a chunk of walnut, Postman. Well done. |
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Quote: I will need to get a pirate's eye patch for the mount once the taxidermist is done. :-) On a positive note, 5 of 7 shots were fatal. My 1st buffalo, and I just kept shooting and shooting. Kinda scared shitless and in "shooting auto-pilot" at 35 yards... At some point, the trackers shouted that I could stop shooting because the bull was down. |
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nice rifle, nice buffalo! |
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I bought my first DR in 1951 as a High School Junior. I have owned a DR at least all of my hunting years. I actually carried one to Africa on 4 different occaisons but actually only used one once on an Elephant. I had the romantic notion that that is what should be used. I found the pleasure of using it to successfully harvest game was no more pleasurable than with a nice bolt gun. My next and last safari I took my Elephant with a custom 416Rigby bolt gun. I glance at the tusks as I write this and the memory comes flowing back. Incidentally after selling the gun I took the Elephant with I bought one last DR which is now long gone. It finally dawned on me that all things considered they were just not worth it. I have managed to live comfortably for the last 10 years without one. I know it's near heresy on this forum but I think they are the biggest con-job in African lore. |
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My most recent, a Scimitar-Horned Oryx, taken two months ago in Texas with my 9.3 x 74 Rimmed. I built this rifle on a BRNO ZP-47 action. |
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More photos required here. |
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Yes, as often as possible: |
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Absolutely otherwise I never would have bought it, I call mine the working man's double and intend to put a lot more scratches on it. I just wish I could do more hunting during the pandemic BS and that I could find the proper scope mounting system for it. With my current factory loads the open sights hit 2" and 1" left at 50m but it's spot on with a scope. |
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Can you not adjust the rear sight(s) to be spot-on? Won't take much movement. |
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I have taken elephant, buffalo, a lion and a leopard with my Krieghoff Teck O/U double rifle, with interchangeable barrels in .458 WM and .375 H&H. I have also taken eland and greater and lesser kudu with the same rifle. At the time I bought the rifle (1970), Kynoch had ceased manufacturing ammunition for the classic double rifle cartridges, hence the use of rimless cartridges. However, the extractors/ejectors have never failed to work as designed. |
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Heres a few pics of my double hunts Chapius 9.3x74 Thomas Blissett .500 nitro Chris's rifle merkel 40 450-400 Greener Empire. 577 2 3/4 "Fat Lady" |
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Quote: No unfortunately regulated and set at the factory, and I can't buy the ammo it was regulated with. But I could, and probably should fit an adjustable rear sight, but for my needs being up close and snap shots they work just fine. I only put a scope on so I can shoot reduced cast bullet loads for when I go chasing pigs. |
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Good pictures, gentlemen. Thanks. |
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What a silly question!!! “Of course” is the appropriate answer…. My latest was last fall, filling the tags of 50% of my hunt camp….. party hunting for whitetail can turn oneself into a less that popular dude. Thank heavens my crew is understanding and when plied with loads of really good scotch are the forgiving type!!!!!! |
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Thread started in 2008. Last pictures two years ago. Anyone hunting since? |
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Yes. 1880s Birmingham made .500 – 450 Nr.1 BPE signed by A.Robertson & Sons, Wick (as far north in Scotland as you can go without getting wet feet) |