| rpeck |
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| 12/11/19 06:49 AM |
Understudy carbine
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"The advantage of having an “understudy” rifle chambered in .22 LR similar in ergonomics and controls to its full-powered sibling is well recognized."
- Sako M78 .22LR fullstock
- Sako AV .375 H&H "Mannlicher" carbine.
Exceptional wood with the same checkering pattern on both.
Both with Sako peep sights. (The one on the .22 is designed for its non-tapered dovetails.)
Both in excellent condition. A useful pair.
NitroX
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| (.700 member) |
| 12/11/19 11:56 AM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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That's different.
| tinker |
| (.416 member) |
| 12/11/19 04:06 PM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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Pretty cool.
I've often thought about making full length sob caliber liners for my centerfire hunting rifles.
This is a few steps further into the concept.
| Homer |
| (.416 member) |
| 12/11/19 07:15 PM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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G'Day Fella's,
Thanks for sharing rpec and Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm Sako's!
I once had the opportunity to buy the same Sako AV .375 H&H "Mannlicher" carbine, from a mate of mine (DD) but didn't have the cash at the time ......... D'oh! and BUGGER!
D'h!
Homer
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NitroX
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| (.700 member) |
| 12/11/19 08:33 PM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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The mini me copies of larger calibres, a .22 RF made similar to eg the .375 might make sense to the one gun hunter. Familiar in every way with the main rifle.
But for a guy having 10, 20, 50, 100 rifles ... no purpose a all. As he will not be familiar with any of them intimately.
I do like both of those rifles.
What is the barrel length of the .375? What velocity do you get from it?
Thanks.
| rpeck |
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| 13/11/19 06:32 AM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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Quote:
The mini me copies of larger calibres, a .22 RF made similar to eg the .375 might make sense to the one gun hunter. Familiar in every way with the main rifle.
But for a guy having 10, 20, 50, 100 rifles ... no purpose a all. As he will not be familiar with any of them intimately.
No purpose at all? I respectfully disagree.
I'm in the "20-50 rifles" ownership group and yet I have found .22LR rifles of approximately the same size, weight, mechanical function and with approx. the same sights as my actual hunting rifles to be useful. They don't have to be exact copies, just more or less similar in terms of mechanical function, size and sights. You can shoot .22s all year round at paper, tin cans and gophers, etc. and shoot them a lot.. for not much money. They helped me particularly with developing quick and accurate offhand snapshooting. I know some fellows prefer to practice off season with only their actual hunting rifles but that can become expensive and in some cases, particularly with lightweight carrying rifles, can also lead to the development of a flinch.
(That being said, all my rifles are more or less the same in that they are all bolt action rifles in various calibers between .22LR and .375 H&H.)
| 93x64mm |
| (.416 member) |
| 13/11/19 06:50 AM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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Never seen Sako's like that!
Certainly along the Stutzen side of things.
I've heard of their peep sight, before though; fully adjustable - any chance of close up(s) of one of the peeps please?
Should certainly be great hunting rifles, Sako do make rather good gear
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NitroX
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| (.700 member) |
| 13/11/19 12:33 PM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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Quote:
No purpose at all? I respectfully disagree.
I'm in the "20-50 rifles" ownership group and yet I have found .22LR rifles of approximately the same size, weight, mechanical function and with approx. the same sights as my actual hunting rifles to be useful. They don't have to be exact copies, just more or less similar in terms of mechanical function, size and sights. You can shoot .22s all year round at paper, tin cans and gophers, etc. and shoot them a lot.. for not much money. They helped me particularly with developing quick and accurate offhand snapshooting. I know some fellows prefer to practice off season with only their actual hunting rifles but that can become expensive and in some cases, particularly with lightweight carrying rifles, can also lead to the development of a flinch.
(That being said, all my rifles are more or less the same in that they are all bolt action rifles in various calibers between .22LR and .375 H&H.)
As I said for the "100 rifle" owning man, the point of familiarity is already lost no matter what mini me's he has! Unless most are safe queens.
But it is a useful concept.
I have previously written teaching myself to shoot and reload a bolt action at the shoulder using a .22 RF and the actual centrefire bolt action. The point was not dropping the rifle between shots to work the bolt. 20 to 40 rounds through the .22, a few through the centrefire and fixed. Also easy to do again to reinforce.
I like both of your rifles, thanks for posting the photo.
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NitroX
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| (.700 member) |
| 13/11/19 12:36 PM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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BTW when the Sako Stitzen came out,I did think it had nice lines. Pity they discontinued the model.
I think the local advert was for .243 and .308 and similar. Never saw a .375 H&H Mag type calibre offered. 9.3x62 would be a good one too
| 9.3x57 |
| (.450 member) |
| 13/11/19 01:39 PM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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I sold piles of those AV Hunter carbines back in the early '90's.
It's not a bad idea to have a pin set in the guide rib to prevent breakage of the guide rib flange and subsequent lockup of the bolt caused by the guide rib slipping forward and preventing rotation of the bolt.
I've been told it is a serious problem with .416's and a maybe-problem w/ .375's. For myself, having two of the AV Finnbears, one in .3765 and the other merely 6.5x55, I had the work done anyway.
| rpeck |
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| 13/11/19 11:41 PM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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Quote:
I sold piles of those AV Hunter carbines back in the early '90's.
It's not a bad idea to have a pin set in the guide rib to prevent breakage of the guide rib flange and subsequent lockup of the bolt caused by the guide rib slipping forward and preventing rotation of the bolt.
I've been told it is a serious problem with .416's and a maybe-problem w/ .375's. For myself, having two of the AV Finnbears, one in .3765 and the other merely 6.5x55, I had the work done anyway.
I have heard of this before. Can you give any details of the procedure for installing the pin? I would have a qualified gunsmith do it, but want to know what I will be asking him to do.
| rpeck |
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| 13/11/19 11:57 PM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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Quote:Quote:
As I said for the "100 rifle" owning man, the point of familiarity is already lost no matter what mini me's he has! Unless most are safe queens.
But it is a useful concept.
I have previously written teaching myself to shoot and reload a bolt action at the shoulder using a .22 RF and the actual centrefire bolt action. The point was not dropping the rifle between shots to work the bolt. 20 to 40 rounds through the .22, a few through the centrefire and fixed. Also easy to do again to reinforce.
I would think that for the "100 rifle man" most of his rifles are necessarily "safe queens." I have no problem with this. I have met gun collectors who don't shoot, who don't even own any ammunition. When I was a young hunter I thought this was absurd, but I have learned to respect their reasons for owning guns, even though they are very different from mine.
re:"The point was not dropping the rifle between shots to work the bolt."
To help with this I taught myself to never pick up brass after a game shot. I now always automatically and immediately crank another round into the chamber after my first shot, and the rifle does not leave my shoulder. The brass is ejected quick and far and I never look for it.
| Igorrock |
| (.400 member) |
| 21/11/19 04:06 AM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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Sako M78 .22LR with fullstock is very, very rare. Here in Finland I have seen fullstock Sakos in many calibers but this .22LR should be a special factory order.
| Louis |
| (.375 member) |
| 21/11/19 07:45 AM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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Most desirable rifles Robin, like all the ones you present on the Forum; you're a man of great taste!
I wish you to enjoy good hunting with both.
Louis
| rpeck |
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| 22/11/19 02:53 AM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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Quote:
Never seen Sako's like that!
Certainly along the Stutzen side of things.
I've heard of their peep sight, before though; fully adjustable - any chance of close up(s) of one of the peeps please?
Should certainly be great hunting rifles, Sako do make rather good gear
There are numerous variations of the Sako receiver peep sight. Here are a few, including the one for untapered dovetails:
| DarylS |
| (.700 member) |
| 22/11/19 04:37 AM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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Seems to me, I recall seeing those aperture sights back in the mid 1970's.
| rpeck |
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| 22/11/19 05:04 AM |
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Re: Understudy carbine
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They came standard from the Sako factory with the rifles that had a front sight but no open rear sight on the barrel. Sako hasn't made them for decades but you can still pick them up at gunshows, etc. They are getting expensive though.