(.577 member)

18/07/18 12:20 PM

USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

**UPDATE** 2018: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle cartridge.

Two articles regarding the above--

It would seem, contrary to the believe of some, the Creedmoor is here to stay for a very long time..NO small item getting adopted by the military..

https://www.pewpewtactical.com/6-5-creedmoor-guide/

https://www.popularmechanics.com/militar...-sniper-bullet/

(.416 member)

18/07/18 05:52 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Ripp, thanks for posting. That is interesting. I also believe it is a good step in the right direction.

(.577 member)

19/07/18 09:31 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

Ripp, thanks for posting. That is interesting. I also believe it is a good step in the right direction.

Watching a recorder GUNS AND AMMO show last night ..this was brought up in the discussion..stating right now the round is closed to the .223 as far as sales in the USA..and in the top 10 of total sales per year ..quite a leap from 10 years ago..

Former Special Forces guy was discussing his use of this caliber in long distance competition..
Per the guy talking, the 6.5 vs the .308 Win.. is 33% flatter and 20+% less recoil..that is significant for long strings of fire if accurate..

As the article stated, there isn't a main stream gun manufacturer right now that isn't chambering at least one of their rifles for this round..

Ripp

(.400 member)

20/07/18 07:35 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Its just the .280 British in a modern format.
Nato should have adopted it instead of the 7.62.

(.416 member)

22/07/18 08:29 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

G'Day Fella's,

Being the owner of a 6.5x47 Lapua chambered rifle, this USSOCOM CM decision, doesn't surprise me.
They are both (and the 280 British),great little cartridges.

D'oh!
Homer

(.275 member)

26/07/18 09:39 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

The 6.5 CM has a little more velocity than the 280 British (1945), or the earlier 276 Pedersen (1923) cartridges. Not a lot is new in the world of firearms. The quality of the brass, and projectiles has improved dramatically however.

(.577 member)

27/07/18 02:11 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

The 6.5 CM has a little more velocity than the 280 British (1945), or the earlier 276 Pedersen (1923) cartridges. Not a lot is new in the world of firearms. The quality of the brass, and projectiles has improved dramatically however.

Agree--yes the bullets have certainly come a long way in the past few years, not just for rifle, but for handgun as well...doing some of the penetration tests we have been doing, its amazing what a 9mm is capable of now...

Rifle as well..there is still the old standby's like the partition which seem to work well for most, however for the higher velocity calibers, prefer a more durable construction..but yes, depending on what you are doing, hunting, targets, long distance , there is a bullet for everyone..

Lately the 6.5 PRC is showing up more and more with guys I see at the range..

Ripp

(.577 member)

08/08/18 01:43 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Good article on tv last night watching GUNS AND AMMO as I mentioned in another post

Per the article the 260 Remington had won out two years ago--for several reasons, one being Hornady was the only manufacturer..so if that factory went down, that's it for supply..however the 6.5 CM has become so popular and manufactured now by so many different companies that this is no longer a concern..

Apparently the 6CM was also being considered, however barrel life was significantly less than the 6.5..so the 6.5CM got the nod...in with the new, out with the .308

(.577 member)

29/12/18 06:52 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Cool video on new rifle//scope combo
https://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news/yo...kR9JYKwsjkE9vMw

(.416 member)

29/12/18 07:51 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

The new rifle I see is still based on the Rem 700 Action. The Nightforce scopes are rugged as you can get.

I thought they might have gone with the new Hornady 30 round but staying with the tried and proven 300Win Mag.

(.577 member)

29/12/18 10:40 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

The new rifle I see is still based on the Rem 700 Action. The Nightforce scopes are rugged as you can get.

I thought they might have gone with the new Hornady 30 round but staying with the tried and proven 300Win Mag.

From what I hear and read--they are also going to use them in 6.5 Creedmoor--there is a 6 page article about it in this months GUNS AND AMMO

A lot of gun guys I visit with tell me Rem actions are one of the easiest actions to get to shoot well mostly because of the design..have several customs built on them and they are true one holers..

Agree on the Nightforce as well..great scopes..bomb proof or aweful close--my only complaint is weight--will not use them on my mtn rifles..but all others, absolutely..have one on my .338 Lapua--works very well in all aspects..

(.416 member)

29/12/18 07:10 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

Quote:

The new rifle I see is still based on the Rem 700 Action. The Nightforce scopes are rugged as you can get.

I thought they might have gone with the new Hornady 30 round but staying with the tried and proven 300Win Mag.

From what I hear and read--they are also going to use them in 6.5 Creedmoor--there is a 6 page article about it in this months GUNS AND AMMO

A lot of gun guys I visit with tell me Rem actions are one of the easiest actions to get to shoot well mostly because of the design..have several customs built on them and they are true one holers..

Agree on the Nightforce as well..great scopes..bomb proof or aweful close--my only complaint is weight--will not use them on my mtn rifles..but all others, absolutely..have one on my .338 Lapua--works very well in all aspects..

I was wondering if they were going down the 6.5CM path with the new rifle as well.

Agree about the 700 Action. have a Nightforce NXS on one of my general hunting rifles. Very good gear.

(.400 member)

30/12/18 01:15 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

The Articles posted by Ripp were published in Spring 2018.

In the fall-October and November there were a flurry of articles about the 6.8SPC being adapted for the New Squad Automatic Rifle,

https://www.tactical-life.com/news/us-army-6-8mm-weapon-systems/

https://www.tactical-life.com/lifestyle/military-and-police/next-gen-us-army-6-8mm-round/

https://taskandpurpose.com/army-next-generation-rifle-round

I wonder what it will be in the end, 6.5 or 6.8?

(.400 member)

30/12/18 01:50 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

The second article seems most informative as it make it clear this only a call for prototype, not adaptation of any specific cartridge or weapon.

(.450 member)

30/12/18 05:26 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Articles proclaiming this and that are abundant, but I can't see 5.56 being dumped any time soon for general issue. At least not till a good polymer-cased round is selected?? Metal-cased ammo has pretty much run its course and is at an evolutionary dead end. For all the whining done about the 5.56, all of the advantages that encouraged its adoption in the first place still apply and Big Army still knows that. So do its downsides of course.

Since the acquisition rules changes some years ago, various .mil organizations will continue to pick and choose what they like and run with them, with civilian projects glomming on to proclaim "adoption by the military" to help market their product.

(.577 member)

30/12/18 05:29 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

The second article seems most informative as it make it clear this only a call for prototype, not adaptation of any specific cartridge or weapon.

The last article I read stated one of the concerns with the 6.5 CM initially was only one company was manufacturing brass--now that there are 5 or 6, no longer a concern. Stated it was down to the 260 Rem or the 6.5CM --in the end the Creedmoor won out.. stated cartridge design was a big part as the CM operated more efficiently in the AR platform..

Yes agree also have read about the 6.8 being tested as well..personally I feel the 6.5 will win out for a lot of reasons..but, its a gov. decision so who knows where that will go..

At one point while testing per the ANNUAL issue of GUNS AND AMMO it stated, if barrel life was NOT a consideration, the 6mm would have gotten the nod..but the 6.5 has 2 to 3 times longer barrel life..so�.???

(.450 member)

30/12/18 06:35 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

6.5 CM.

The final vindication of the 6.5 Italian Carcano!!

(.450 member)

30/12/18 06:38 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

A wile back I read of some feeding problems considered inherent in the case design of the 6.5 CM. I don't recall the details, but for those googling, it might be an interesting search. Can't imagine it would be truly significant as popular as the round is, but might show up in endurance/reliability testing by mil agencies?

(.416 member)

30/12/18 01:55 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

6.5 CM.

The final vindication of the 6.5 Italian Carcano!!

What seems to be overlooked by many is the results the Allied soldiers found during the war. It was often said by Aussie Diggers that if the Japs used a 303 round and not the 6.5 many more Diggers would be dead or not fit to return to service when finally discharged from recovery wards. The Japs must have thought the same as they went to the 7.7 round.

(.450 member)

30/12/18 02:29 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

Quote:

6.5 CM.

The final vindication of the 6.5 Italian Carcano!!

What seems to be overlooked by many is the results the Allied soldiers found during the war. It was often said by Aussie Diggers that if the Japs used a 303 round and not the 6.5 many more Diggers would be dead or not fit to return to service when finally discharged from recovery wards. The Japs must have thought the same as they went to the 7.7 round.

It's an interesting suggestion!!

No idea about the Digger accounts, but bullets make a difference and certainly in the old style round nose long heavy bullets less effective wounding would be likely. US Army testing cited by Genl Julian Hatcher in the pre-war era definitively demonstrated the ".256" {6.5} caliber to produce far more traumatic wounds in pig and other livestock testing. This with, IIRC, a 123 or so Spitzer bullet. Roy Dunlap more or less praised the 6.5 Jap caliber and Lt Col John George in his famous "Shots Fired in Anger" stated the Jap 6.5 was "entirely adequate in mankilling".

The move to the 7.7 in Jap service has been described being done for advantages in larger volume for tracing material and of course in the heavier bullet ball cartridge more effective penetration of "soft" obstacles {wood barriers, building materials, etc}.

George praises the Jap 6.5 for its ease of shooting and he himself carried a Jap carbine for a while. It's shootability alone might have claimed more lives than its more diminutive ballistics lost, if the latter actually occurred. He is dead right about the shootability. Almost zero recoil. We have a Jap 6.5 Arisaka and I used it to place very high against modern, topline AR's on the ARFCOM SHTF Challenge with shooting of 15 shots in 3 minutes, field positions-only, no prone, no sling at 100 meters in spite of the need to reload the 5-shot mag by hand {no clips} versus the AR's with no need to reload at all. As a combat weapon the Jap 6.5 would be hard to beat among the bolt guns. A Lee-Enfield with a 10 or 12 shot mag in 6.5 Jap or Carcano would be the Cat's Rat!!

(.416 member)

30/12/18 09:17 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Yes the calibres with the minimum amount of recoil are easier to shoot. One of the criticisms labeled against the 30-06 was its recoil.

Certainly the bigger the hole the quicker the blood comes out. Bullets with better designs for maiming/killing will do a better job then designs of old.

The 6.5 Japs shootability may not have helped claim that many more lives as its effectiveness would rely on good shot placement. Not something that was noted in rushed combat and they where not firing the 123grain spitzer. They were more typically 139 grains.

I do take what the good Lt Col said as personal opinion and not much more, simply as he is the only person I have heard of that rated the 6.5 Jap. Most did not. If they had of used a 123 grain spitzer at a higher muzzle velocity it may well have proved more effective, bit like the Brits dropping from a 212grain bullet in the 303 to a 174 grain.

Most of my reading has shown the Japs going up in calibre to achieve better battle field results against the enemy troops and to standardize ammo in their machineguns. The standard 6.5 rifle ammo proved to hot for their machine guns so the ammo for the MG's were down loaded.

(.577 member)

31/12/18 03:32 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

It is interesting the topic of bullets was brought up--in the same article I quoted from earlier..bullets were another important part of the test..per the article a LOT of bullets were tested in various mediums, distances,, etc...per the article the final winner was the 136 gr Lapua Scenar-L. that produced the best accuracy and terminal effects..

Per the article, one of the other advantages of the 6.5CM vs the .260REM is the longer bullets take up less powder room because of the neck-shoulder junction on the 6.5CM

Article also stated this is the first time in modern history the .308 (7.62) has lost ground with the US military

(.577 member)

31/12/18 03:46 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

Articles proclaiming this and that are abundant, but I can't see 5.56 being dumped any time soon for general issue. At least not till a good polymer-cased round is selected?? Metal-cased ammo has pretty much run its course and is at an evolutionary dead end. For all the whining done about the 5.56, all of the advantages that encouraged its adoption in the first place still apply and Big Army still knows that. So do its downsides of course.

Since the acquisition rules changes some years ago, various .mil organizations will continue to pick and choose what they like and run with them, with civilian projects glomming on to proclaim "adoption by the military" to help market their product.

Another huge consideration/advantage of the polymer case is weight being carried by the individual soldier..huge difference in weight between the two..metal vs polymer..

http://www.gunsandammo.com/editorial/true-velocitys-new-polymer-cased-ammunition/247607

(.416 member)

31/12/18 09:37 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

Quote:

Articles proclaiming this and that are abundant, but I can't see 5.56 being dumped any time soon for general issue. At least not till a good polymer-cased round is selected?? Metal-cased ammo has pretty much run its course and is at an evolutionary dead end. For all the whining done about the 5.56, all of the advantages that encouraged its adoption in the first place still apply and Big Army still knows that. So do its downsides of course.

Since the acquisition rules changes some years ago, various .mil organizations will continue to pick and choose what they like and run with them, with civilian projects glomming on to proclaim "adoption by the military" to help market their product.

Another huge consideration/advantage of the polymer case is weight being carried by the individual soldier..huge difference in weight between the two..metal vs polymer..

http://www.gunsandammo.com/editorial/true-velocitys-new-polymer-cased-ammunition/247607

Ripp that is, to my limited knowledge of caseless ammo, one of the main reasons for going to it. That is along with saving raw materials (brass) and the weight & volume for transport.

(.450 member)

01/01/19 04:24 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Articles proclaiming this and that are abundant, but I can't see 5.56 being dumped any time soon for general issue. At least not till a good polymer-cased round is selected?? Metal-cased ammo has pretty much run its course and is at an evolutionary dead end. For all the whining done about the 5.56, all of the advantages that encouraged its adoption in the first place still apply and Big Army still knows that. So do its downsides of course.

Since the acquisition rules changes some years ago, various .mil organizations will continue to pick and choose what they like and run with them, with civilian projects glomming on to proclaim "adoption by the military" to help market their product.

Another huge consideration/advantage of the polymer case is weight being carried by the individual soldier..huge difference in weight between the two..metal vs polymer..

http://www.gunsandammo.com/editorial/true-velocitys-new-polymer-cased-ammunition/247607

Ripp that is, to my limited knowledge of caseless ammo, one of the main reasons for going to it. That is along with saving raw materials (brass) and the weight & volume for transport.

Weight savings of ammo has always been of extreme importance in the development of cartridge ammunition.

But it brings along with it problems. Notably a reduction in penetration of many obstacles, remembering that military weapons are not merely designed for killing and/or incapacitating enemy combatants. Small arms are also used for signalling, breaching of walls, etc. I used to have a USMC data sheet citing the number of rounds needed to create shooting slits/loopholes, manholes, etc thru various types of construction materials, listing the various calibers.

Anyway, the polymer cased stuff has its upside and downsides, too. It has been challenged by issues involving handling proof and overheating of automatic weapons {doesn't remove heat like brass cases do}. They'll get that stuff sorted out and then we will see excuses made for reduced economies of scale when the technology hits the commercial market and prices for brass cases for our favorite ammo and reloading skyrocket!! Just wait!

(.416 member)

01/01/19 08:44 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

9.3x57, I agree with all that you said.

(.577 member)

01/01/19 01:05 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

9.3x57, I agree with all that you said.

Rule303, I agree with all that you said about all the 9.3x57 said...

Hey, sorry, its New Years..brings out the smart ass in me...

That and a Moscow mule or two..

(.416 member)

01/01/19 10:14 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

Quote:

9.3x57, I agree with all that you said.

Rule303, I agree with all that you said about all the 9.3x57 said...

Hey, sorry, its New Years..brings out the smart ass in me... That and a Moscow mule or two..

Entirely understandable in the given situation.

(.700 member)

02/01/19 06:30 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Here it is, 9:28AM, 1/1/2019.
ALL THE BEST FOR EVERYONE in 2019.
From Maui, with love.

(.416 member)

02/01/19 10:08 AM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

Here it is, 9:28AM, 1/1/2019.
ALL THE BEST FOR EVERYONE in 2019.
From Maui, with love.

From Maui

You are just trying to make us envious...............................it worked

(.577 member)

02/01/19 01:28 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

Quote:

Here it is, 9:28AM, 1/1/2019.
ALL THE BEST FOR EVERYONE in 2019.
From Maui, with love.

From Maui

You are just trying to make us envious...............................it worked

Didn't work on me--we are sitting at a nice balmy -15F this morning on my way to practice.. who needs that warm sunny beach weather???

d

Happy NEW YEARS everyone..
Best to a fantastic 2019

Ripp

(.416 member)

02/01/19 07:56 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Yes, all the best for the New Year to all. Hope every body stays safe and prospers.

(.577 member)

09/11/19 01:56 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

More info I found today..seems this is a reality.

https://sofrep.com/news/socom-wants-to-u...RWg2Cg-9Yc42Vp4

(.450 member)

09/11/19 02:04 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

And another;

https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2019...ts-armament-co/

(.416 member)

09/11/19 06:56 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Looking like the 6.5CM is here to stay for some time to come.

(.577 member)

09/11/19 07:58 PM

Re: USSOCOM has adopted the 6.5 CM as their new Precision Rifle

Quote:

Looking like the 6.5CM is here to stay for some time to come.

I was with a group of individuals the other night that are in the know..they stated similar sentiments

NitroExpress.com

Powered by UBB.threads™ 6.5.5

Home | Ezine | Forums | Links | Contact

Copyright 2003 to 2011 - all rights reserved