Thanks for all the info Daryl. I have a .690 mould and a .715 mould and have been saving 12 ga. hulls for this project. I will go to the local trap range for some "cups". Now about that rifling, I have considered building a bench and cutting it myself, but I am not too far away from Bill Moody, I may see if he will cut it for me. So your suggestions would be 1 in 80 twist .006 depth. (max) and 191 grns FF to get a vel. of around 1600 fps. I am not doubting your word but when I calculated round ball twist useing the Greenhill formula a few years ago I came up with something like 103 for a .690 ball. why do you recommend a faster twist????THANKS, Ed