Dear Szihn

Thank you for the reply and the manner in which it was phrased. I feel no disrespect, this is an exchange of opinions, not theology

I have not seen your bullets used but I inhabit the leverguns forum where they do indeed get very good press.

I have seen and shot solid 405 grain heads pushed to the limits of the cartridge safe pressure (and beyond?) and was unimpressed with the results.

I am quite happy to conceed to your extensive testing regarding comparative penetration with your heads and accept your statment, I have no reason to doubt you.

However perhaps you will accept that they are specialist loads, it is most unlikley that you will walk into a gunshop in SA or Zim and find a box on the shelf.
Would you also conceed that if I take a 375 H+H and make some unusually heavy and long for caliber solids and drive them to the very maximum that a 98 action will stand, that the results might be reversed ?

Again I have not used your loads so exclude you and your product from this bit []. [I have read threads on the LG forum where top performance with 45-70, .450 and .50 lever guns is because people are loading them to the very edge. I have seen the pictures of LG,s posted that have failed at the reciever ring beacause of large cartridges and high pressures.]

In that regard when discussing "adaquate calibers" then as I said, one is properly talking about factory loads. In that regard my 450#2 is also useless for the same reason.
Properly then we should compare say Fedral 470.NE with Fedral 45-70 Gov. Solids. Then to compound the situation compare softs in the 2 calibers. (one could do the same with .375 9.3 .404 .416 Rigby etc etc).

Your loads and others like you have indeed made the 45-70 what it was not some years ago, good for you and I am glad that people get out and hunt with whatever makes them happy and confident.

One cannot doubt that they kill game, the evidence is clear. However I still do not want to be slapped around by a 7 1/2 lb 4000 ftlb rifle (I abhore muzzle breaks).

I was on Safari in 2007 where 45-70 LG's were used by three of the party. Of three Blue Wildebeest shot, 1 fell to a "lever evolution" round. 2 others were lost. I shot 2 with a 450#2 and neither moved from the spot. I am the first to conceed that it is not a large or representative sample, but I can only call it as I have seen it myself.

As to the other things that I wrote I stand by them.

Best Regards