From: Anthropoid (Original Message) Sent: 11/12/2002 1:34 PM
J.P. Sauer Drilling

ŠPaul M. Alvarez

The German machinists frequently turn simple tools into works of art. Blending art and ingenuity, nowhere is this more evident than in their gunmaking. An example of this is "gun art" this drilling manufactured by J.P. Sauer and Sons in Suhl Germany sometime before WWII. Between 1903 and 1938 from the style of the proofmarks. It was originally intended as a working tool rather than a show piece, yet something as simple as the company logo and the makers name is hand engraved and embellished on the action. Even the screws are engraved! This certainly does not make the gun shoot any better, but it enhances the pride of ownership.

This Sauer has a box-lock action with a Greener cross-bolt for strength. The button on the tang selects between the rifle barrel and the shotgun barrel. When the rifle is selected the rear sight pops up for use, when the shotgun barrel is selected the sight lays flush with the rib for an unbroken sighting plane. The safety is on the left side of the action just above the triggers. The top rib is set-up for a quick detachable claw mount scope.

Drillings are the most versatile guns available for hunting. At the touch of a button you have available either a double barrel shotgun or a combination rifle and shotgun with an instant choice of shot, buck, slug, or bullet.. They are popular in Europe for two primary reasons. First, the hunting seasons there are such that you might be hunting birds and large game at the same time. Second, the gun laws tend to be much more restrictive than ours and owning multiple firearms is sometimes prohibited or, at least, very difficult. With the increasingly more restrictive laws in this country, guns of this type might have a place in our future.

A Drilling handles about as well as a normal side-by-side shotgun and comes to the shoulder very readily. Being able to use one gun for all of your hunting has the advantage of only needing to learn one set of controls. Additionally, it provides you with the opportunity to practice and hunt all year round. Clay pigeons during the off season, birds, small game, all with your deer rifle!

The most common configuration for these pieces is a pair of 16 ga. shotgun barrels with the rifle tube in either 7X57R, such as this one or, if more power is needed, in 8X57R, though they can be had in a variety of other calibers as well. The 16 ga. is preferred because it results in a smaller and lighter action than the 12 ga. while providing almost as much power. During WWII the German Luftwaffe used to issue a Drilling to their pilots for survival use chambered in 12 ga. over a 9.3X74R tube, a cartridge that is in the same class as the .375 H&H!

The 7X57R cartridge, although never loaded in this country, is very popular in Europe. It is one of a series of rimmed sporting cartridges that Mauser developed from their rimless versions. The 7 mm rimmed is identical to the standard 7 mm Mauser in all dimensions with the exception of having a rim for ease in extraction when used in Drillings, single shots, and combination guns. RWS lists 6 loads ranging from a 123 grain cone point at 2920 fps to a 177 grain Brenneke TIG load at 2460 fps. Muzzle energy is around 2300 ft.-lbs. Norma has two loadings, a FMJ and a Soft Point, both weighing 150 grains, at 2690 fps. Brass is available from both companies and standard .284 bullets are plentiful. The only challenge in reloading this cartridge is comming up with a load that hits to point of aim. This cartridge is suitable for any but the biggest game on this continent.

I should think the drilling would get a few votes

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Recommend Delete Message 8 of 22 in Discussion

From: Honey badger Sent: 11/18/2002 3:20 AM
A chap I used to shoot with carried a beautiful 16 bore hammerless gun, dating from the early 1900s - and he used it to much greater effect than most of us with our 12 bores ever did.

I can only wish that I could get an issued weapon like that lovely drilling - instead of that pile of junk called the SA80. In the bad old days in Northern Ireland, bomb disposal teams were issued with Browning semi-auto shotguns. They were supposed to be fitted to the wheelbarrow (remotely operated vehicle) but were often carried by team members for personal protection instead. By the time I did my first tour in the early 90s the shotguns had their barrels cut down to 12" and had the butts removed so that they could fit on to the later marks of wheelbarrow, so that practice had ended. Shame. Below is a picture of me on aforementioned first tour, in South Armagh, bearing aforementioned pile of junk!

Message 9 of 22 in Discussion

From: Bigfive Sent: 11/18/2002 11:42 PM
HB,
If you come to Africa you can leave the helmet the gun.........The outfit will work perfectly........lol
hahaha...........just pulling your leg

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Recommend Delete Message 10 of 22 in Discussion

From: Honey badger Sent: 11/19/2002 3:30 AM
Right, that's it - safari cancelled!!!. LOL . I couldn't wear all that stuff in Africa: I'd be sweating like Bob M at a Commonwealth conference. Still, could be worse, I could could wear the rest of my working gear - 90lbs of hot kevlar fun. Should be safe from the lions, though.

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From: Anthropoid Sent: 11/19/2002 11:19 AM

I noticed the hideous facial disfigurement....Were you caught in a blast?

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Recommend Delete Message 12 of 22 in Discussion

From: Honey badger Sent: 11/19/2002 9:03 PM
I'll have you know that I am, in fact, feverishly handsome. Well, that's what I've been telling the girls in the NAAFI disco!

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Recommend Delete Message 13 of 22 in Discussion

From: Nitro Sent: 11/20/2002 2:51 AM
Honey Badger

You have one job I do not envy you having

.... experience adventure, see exotic places, meet interesting people, get blown up into small pieces ........

I bet that was never in a recruitment advertisement!

Good luck to you and keep all your parts attached where they should be.

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Recommend Delete Message 14 of 22 in Discussion

From: Honey badger Sent: 11/20/2002 3:07 AM
Thanks Nitro

As a matter of fact I have been blown up, by some dizzy tart who dropped a
grenade on a range in Kenya. This was not long after I was charged by an
elephant I'd managed to annoy - I didn't know much about them then. And not
long before that, one of our guys acting as range sentry asked over the
radio for a rifle to be brought out. When asked why he said "There's a lion
looking at me funny!" I can trace my interest in big game and big game
rifles directly to these two incidents. The most gun available was a 5.56 mm
SA80 - I wish I'd had that .500 NE then!

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From: Anthropoid Sent: 11/20/2002 11:43 AM
HB aka Feverishly Handsome.

Are you still in that line of work old boy ?

Does Felix still use candles for disruption?

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Recommend Delete Message 16 of 22 in Discussion

From: Anthropoid Sent: 11/24/2002 9:15 PM
I read that some of the simpler bombs used by the Palestinians are identical to those produced by PIRA, lightbulb fuses etc.

There was a very good programme on Ch4 last night, about the bomb disposal teams in WW2. It showed the types of fuses and AHD's used during the Blitz. It's on again next week.

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Recommend Delete Message 17 of 22 in Discussion

From: Honey badger Sent: 11/24/2002 9:46 PM
Anthropiod,

So you know a little about us, then? Candles were replaced by maxi-candles (the same, only more) years ago. We use them against car bombs. The thing I'm carrying in the picture is a disrupter, which uses a propellant cartridge to inject water unto the devices, breaking up the circuitry before the thing can function. There are different sizes for different targets, but I tend to think in hunting terms - "use enough gun"!

Unfortunately we don't get ch4 in Cyprus, just BFBS. I'm in the Royal Logistic Corps (formerly the Royal Army Ordnance Corps until 1993) and we specialise in terrorist/criminal improvised devices and land service conventional munitions. Most, though by no means all, of bomb disposal in WW2 was done by the Royal Engineers, by virtue of the fact that you need to dig a dirty great hole to get to unexploded aircraft bombs, and for that you just open up a tin of sappers. Just had to get that point in because there is a widespread misconception, even in the army, that the RE (bless them) are the 'bomb disposal experts' and the sappers themselves don't make any efforts to disabuse this notion. I'll get off my high horse now.

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Recommend Delete Message 18 of 22 in Discussion

From: Anthropoid Sent: 11/24/2002 11:12 PM
HB. I try and know a little about everything old boy. :-)

Fascinating subject, but rather you than me when dealing with the blighter's :-)

The programme on Ch4 was very good, and it did make one aware that the knowledge available to defuse the bombs was earned at a heavy price, and
that the chaps at the other end were quite capable of devising something very
nasty to trip you up on the next occasion you fiddled with one of their creations.

That aspect of it, the AHD's, are to me the most interesting and I would imagine
you yourself would find them the most worrying. But then, even when you have
dealt with them, the cads might place another surprise in the vicinity for you,
as was common I believe in NI, milk churns etc.
I would love to know more, but I suspect you are limited in what you can say.
You could tell me, but you'd have to kill me afterwards, that sort of thing :-)

You have my greatest respect old chap, and I'm not one to give it lightly.

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Recommend Delete Message 19 of 22 in Discussion

From: Honey badger Sent: 11/25/2002 12:08 AM
Thank you for your kind words, old boy. We've rather strayed from the subject of drillings, though. I could tell you more but I would have to shred you in an MoD approved pattern shredder. You're quite right about cheeky devices. We've had 23 blokes killed in NI or by PIRA devices in GB, mostly in the 1970s. I think only two simply ran out of time. The rest were caught out by something extra, either concealed in the device they were dealing with or by a secondary device.

PS Where did you get the Felix picture?

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Recommend Delete Message 20 of 22 in Discussion

From: Anthropoid Sent: 11/25/2002 2:06 AM
PS Where did you get the Felix picture?

I could tell you but I'd have to shred you in an MoD............

Oh! What the hell.....I'll tell you anyway. :-)

http://www.palacebarracksmemorialgarden.org/Felix%20Memorial%20Garden.htm

Look out for anything screwed to the floor old boy ;-)

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Recommend Delete Message 21 of 22 in Discussion

From: Honey badger Sent: 11/25/2002 4:04 AM
Thanks old boy. I didn't know the website existed. The Felix memorial at
Lisburn was completed while I was in NI. The worrying thing is there's room
for extra stones! I was ATO at Palace Barracks, strangely enough , where the
other memorial garden is and I know the custodian there. He's an ex
paratrooper who now lives in NI and has paid for much of the work on the two
gardens out of his own pocket.

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From: Anthropoid Sent: 11/25/2002 8:54 AM
Glad to be of service old boy.