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Der Jaeger,

With all the apparently phony, or at least innaccurate, hearsay so often repeated about the number of PH's recomending 375's I would have thought the ratio would have been lower.

My own experience regarding PH recomendations (for elephant) runs fairly similar to Boddington's polls, but with less representation of the bigger than 470 rifles. On the other hand, they often come with the caveat, "If the hunter is familiar with his rifle and accustomed to its recoil...," or similar. When the question of what if recoil is an issue is raised then I recall that the 375H&H and the 416's get about equal the number of secondary recomendations. The 375 because it is easy to shoot and the 416's because they offer more performance than the 375, if not as much as the 450's, and are viewed as a plausible compromise.

I've read Boddington's previous book "Safari Rifles." Good info for the most part, but he played favorites and did not do his research in several areas, 458wm performance being one that always comes to my attention. Every time I pull the trigger and see the results, either on the chronograph or on game, or speak with or read of a PH or former elephant culling officer who swears by it.

JPK

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As in the case of Safari Rifles II--actually more praise than is warranted IMHO, is given by Boddington on the .458Win...it goes on to say that with todays advancement in powder and bullet technology, there is basically no fly in the ointment with the .458W...also stated that Hornady I believe, is loading a factory load with 2200 fps velocity with a 500 gr bullet..didn't think it could reach that level..curious what the pressures are at that velocity..

Boddington also goes on stating that in his opinion, the 458 Lott is the 45 to go with, in his self reported elephant hunting history..he states his elephant hunting experience is quite a bit more in the past 3 years..at least more than one..as I seen him shooting several in either "Tracks Across Africa" or on the DVD on elephant with Ivan Carter..


Also stated is a quote from Bell who basically stated if you don't place your shot on an elephant it does not matter whether you hit him with 100 or 10 million..your shot needs to find his mark..
Not sure I agree with that totally, as stated, there is evidence the big bores will turn a bull and that includes the .416...

Johan Calitz, who has a ton, (no pun intended) of elephant experience, states he has seen numerous failures by the older big Nitro calibers as to penetration...so, the issue of penetration again is raised..I am not trying to kill a dead horse hear...but, ....there is also a statements made in seveal areas of the book at the 416, in Rigby, Remington, whatever, traveling at 2400 fps with its long for caliber bullet of 400 grs will outpenetrate a .458 with a 500 even at 2200 every time...which makes sense as the 458 has less speed and more surface area to slow it down..also states the .416 will also turn a bull on a charge...

Actually laughed pretty hard when the story of using a .505 Gibbs, Harland shot a cow through both shoulders, the bullet then went on to hit another ele beside the tail and the bullet was found in the front portion of that cow..now that is penetration..

JPK, I agree with you, if all one is going after, is elephant, I will probably grab my double .470 Westley and call it good...but if there are other animals on the plate..believe I will stick with my .416..again, just in my experience, more versatile and all the penetration I need...

Thx

Ripp

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Rip,

I heard about the foot race. Haven't seen the video. I don't think any man can know if he will break or not until he has faced an elephant coming fast at him. It is a truly impressive sight. Interestingly, both Buzz Charlton and Rich Tabor told me that few guys break and run for it. That's good news I guess since it would make for a really uncomfortable evening in camp, I'm sure!

According to Rich and Buzz, not all guys who don't break are contributing members of the team either. Some freeze, some become wild with their rifles... Both had had clients crap or piss themselves. A couple had given up elephant hunting right there on the spot too.

I've seen trackers head for the hills, and I've seen game scouts do so as well, and they're carrying automatic weapons, which scares the heck out of me.

But most guys do all right and both stand their ground and contribute to the common defense as they can, at least that is what I've been told.

JPK