Had a 17 Bee back in Gunsmith school in the early 50's. It was a bullpup on an 03 action. Then in later years I had one of the first factory 17's a Harrington & Richardson. Very nice on an Fn action I remember. Then again years later a 17 Remington 700. I always ended up selling them when I got completely PO'd about how much trouble they were to get powder into the case. Then I bought one of the first Kimber 17 Mach II's . Shot one hole groups literally but was less than fair on Coyotes. Only good behind the ear for them. So bought one of the Savages with the pretty varigated laminated thumbhole stock in 17HMR. It does in Coyotes easily and the AccuTrigger is pretty neat. And you just buy your ammo off the shelf and never even think of the term reload. Now THAT'S a perfect 17.