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casper50
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Loc: Alaska
.318 WR shooting high to sights
      #215171 - 21/08/12 03:19 PM

I took my Westley .318 Mauser out on Sunday and it shot 12" high at 100 yds using 250 grain woodliegh's and chronoed at 2315fps. The iron sights used require that the front bead be put all the way down into the rear sight which surrounds the bead nicely. I'd rather not screw with the rear sight. Any other options? I can try downloading it but it really shouldn't need that.



Edited by CptCurl (02/12/12 12:56 AM)


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500Nitro
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215172 - 21/08/12 03:32 PM


Can you do something with the front sight ?


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casper50
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: 500Nitro]
      #215173 - 21/08/12 03:55 PM

Even less than the rear.




Edited by CptCurl (02/12/12 12:57 AM)


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500Nitro
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215174 - 21/08/12 04:07 PM


By the way, what Powder are you using ?


Just on the off chance try these.

Change ONE thing at a time and dont forget the 10% rule.


1. Try a different powder
2. Change Primers
3. Change the seating depth.


Now I know it is very unlikely to make 12 inches of difference
but worth a crack.


Re front sight, what about removing it and getting another dovetailed in - although 12 inches, you might need to do something else as it just may end up looking wrong.

Keep us informed.
.


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bonanza
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215181 - 21/08/12 09:05 PM

Downloading will make it shoot higher. Try a lighter bullet as higher velocity.

--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"


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casper50
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: bonanza]
      #215182 - 21/08/12 09:49 PM

Bonanza, I admit I'm not the brightest bulb in the pack but that sounds backwards to me. Can you explain that a little?

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tophet1
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215184 - 21/08/12 10:40 PM

12" high at 100 yards is a six o'clock body hold on a large game animal, dropping the round nicely into the vitals. Where do the rounds go at 200 yards ?

These were not varmint rifles or 100 yard range guns but hunting rifles.


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casper50
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: tophet1]
      #215185 - 21/08/12 10:46 PM

Staff Sergeant Brown taught me to use the 6:00 hold back in 1973 at MCRD. How large of a game animal are you shooting? I would like to use it for moose and brown bear and I can use Kentucky windage but I shouldn't have to. I just have to find a load that will work with the sights.

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tinker
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215186 - 21/08/12 11:01 PM

Taller front sight will fix that.






Cheers
Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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casper50
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: tinker]
      #215188 - 21/08/12 11:14 PM

Know where I can buy one like the original or where I can get one made? That would be the best solution as I like the 250 grain bullets.

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500Nitro
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215190 - 21/08/12 11:58 PM


NECG
Recnagel


I agree re not having to hold at 6 O'Clock, especially if snap shooting at something on the run.


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casper50
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: 500Nitro]
      #215193 - 22/08/12 12:23 AM

Anyone have the formula handy for figuring out the height needed? I can take the measurements and plug them in to find out which one I need to order.

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500Nitro
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215194 - 22/08/12 12:29 AM


Hold on, I'll get it for you.


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500Nitro
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: 500Nitro]
      #215195 - 22/08/12 12:31 AM


This is the Brownells calculator

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/lid=13186/guntechdetail/Sight_Height_Calculator


Their are other manual one's.


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casper50
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: 500Nitro]
      #215196 - 22/08/12 12:32 AM

thanks

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DarylS
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: 500Nitro]
      #215197 - 22/08/12 12:33 AM

I'd change the front sight myself, if possible.

Reducing the height of the rear sight's flat surface is another option, but I'd probably attempt loading changes, different powder.

You are holding the forend with your left hand as you shoot off a rest, aren't you? Letting the rifle bounce by resting the forend on the bags, can give false elevation to the impact. I now hold all kicking rifles as if I was shooting offhand, and rest the back of that forend hand, on the bags. That way, no matter what position I shoot from, the impact is identical.

As 500Nitro posted above, change one thing at a time with testing in between.

12" high at 100, is too high for a rifle that will be used mostly at 100yards or less. Having to always figure "Now, lets see, how much do I have to hold low" is a recipe for disaster when a fast shot must be taken - bear, moose or deer.

To be used as a serious hunting rifle, the rifle must shoot to the sights.

"Holding 6 o'clock" is fine for paper target shooting where the bullet impact is carefully adjusted for that hold on a pardticular sized bull- as with ISU or other round bullseye handgun shooting.

In my opinion, a 6 o'clock hold is less than useless for game - holding 6 o'clock on a moose, elk, black bear, grizzly, brown bear or sitka deer, ie: animals with different height's from the chest's bottom to the boiler room - too much thinking - exactly how far is it? Is it now 15" high, because I'm now 'about' 130yards instead of 100yards?
THIS is why 12" high at 100yards is no good and change must be made somewhere.

I used a BC of .230. It's possible the Woodleigh has a Bc of over .300, thus, the actual height the bullet obtains, will be greater yet.

Ballistic Coeff: 0.230
Bullet Weight: 250
Velocity: 2350
Target Distance: 345
Scope Height: 1.000
Temperature: 70
Altitude: 500

Ballistic Data
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Range Elevation Velocity Energy ETA Drop Max Y 10mph Wind Deflect
0 yds -1.00 in 2350 fps 3065 fpe
25 yds 2.93 in 2263 fps 2843 fpe
50 yds 6.42 in 2178 fps 2634 fpe
75 yds 9.46 in 2095 fps 2437 fpe
100 yds 12.02 in 2014 fps 2251 fpe
125 yds 14.05 in 1934 fps 2076 fpe
150 yds 15.50 in 1856 fps 1913 fpe
175 yds 16.29 in 1781 fps 1761 fpe
200 yds 16.36 in 1709 fps 1621 fpe
225 yds 15.69 in 1639 fps 1490 fpe
250 yds 14.25 in 1570 fps 1369 fpe
275 yds 12.02 in 1504 fps 1255 fpe
300 yds 8.73 in 1441 fps 1153 fpe
325 yds 4.35 in 1382 fps 1061 fpe
350 yds -1.21 in 1327 fps 978 fpe

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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casper50
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Reged: 18/10/07
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Loc: Alaska
Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215198 - 22/08/12 12:33 AM

I think I need one that figures out how much it will raise the impact point.

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DarylS
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215200 - 22/08/12 12:37 AM

I was wondering where 6 o'clock is a charging bear when the bullet is already 3" high, or a sitka deer at 120yards with a bullet that's already 14" high - or was it only 90 - or 140?

--------------------
Daryl


"a gun without hammers is like a Spaniel without ears" King George V


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500Nitro
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215201 - 22/08/12 12:38 AM

Casper

I don't like having to remember to hold differently for different rifles, preferring the bullet to go exactly where aimed.

The reason I don't like 6 O'clock holds was born out to me a year or two ago when clearing a property of Buff.

A Bull Buffalo jumped in front of us and took off across our front flat out to get away across the flood plain. I swung onto it at about 90 yards and dropped it with a head shot. In the heat of the moment, I very much doubt I would have been able to quickly lift the gun up, swing onto it, and through it (for the right lead) and shoot it.

That was with a 318 WR and open sights.


Any time I have to think seriously before shooting like a different hold, different bullet etc, it takes the enjoyment and spontinaity out of it and you can lose it.

Edited by 500Nitro (22/08/12 12:45 AM)


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500Nitro
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: 500Nitro]
      #215203 - 22/08/12 12:42 AM


Casper

I copied this from AR as I don't have my sheet.


Put your particular numbers in this formula and you are good to go.

If you are shooting 6 inches high at 50 yards and there is 24inches between your front and rear sight then
6 x 24 = 144 divided by (50x36=1800) =.08 and that is how much you would need to file the rear sight down or get a front sight .08 higher.


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casper50
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: 500Nitro]
      #215205 - 22/08/12 12:44 AM

All my rifles are set for 6 O'clock

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casper50
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: casper50]
      #215208 - 22/08/12 01:08 AM

Thanks that should get it done.

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bonanza
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: bonanza]
      #215213 - 22/08/12 05:11 AM

At the velocities you are shooting the bullet spends some time in the bbl as it recoils and the muzzle moves up. Speed up the bullet and it will exit sooner while the muzzle is lower.

I dropped the velocity of my .458 WM to 1500 fps from 2000 fsp and it shot 15" high. I then reduced it to 1000 fps and it shot 3" high.

Weird, I know.

--------------------


"Speak Precisely" G. Gordon Liddy.

"Life is absurd, chaotic and we must define its purpose with our actions" Abert Camus

"I''m the dude playing a dude disguised as another dude."

"Yo! Mr. White"


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MikeRowe
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Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: bonanza]
      #215214 - 22/08/12 05:33 AM

That rifle wasn't originally sighted for the 180 grain load, was it? Have you checked the barrel for bullet weight markings?

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casper50
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Loc: Alaska
Re: .318 WR shooting high to sights [Re: MikeRowe]
      #215215 - 22/08/12 05:58 AM

Proof marks says 16gr stmg

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