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470evans
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Loc: Texas, USA
Hornady 450/400 3inch
      #65568 - 09/11/06 01:59 PM

Looks like Hornady has this now listed as available on their website. Wonder when it will be in stores or available as a component?

http://www.hornady.com/story.php?s=483

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CptCurlAdministrator
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Reged: 01/05/04
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Re: Hornady 450/400 3inch [Re: 470evans]
      #65584 - 09/11/06 10:10 PM

This has the potential to be a great development.

Does anybody have information about how the ammo is loaded, i.e. what propellant and primer, any filler?

Curl



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Pilgrim
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Re: Hornady 450/400 3inch [Re: CptCurl]
      #65688 - 11/11/06 04:11 PM

Boddington has a short article on the Hornady ammunition in the latest SCI magazine. According to his article, the ammunition was loaded to 2150 fps and specifically tailered to regulate in DRs chambered for the cartridge. I suspect the load is an equivalent of the full NE loading and not the tropical load, however. With the powders now available I suspect that is no big deal any longer. Pilgrim

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JPK
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Re: Hornady 450/400 3inch [Re: Pilgrim]
      #65699 - 12/11/06 01:13 AM

Hornaday 450/400 3" ammo is loaded with .410" bullets to 2050fps. Seems this is the formula that was safe for all 450/400 3" rifles including rifles with bores at .411" and those at .408". Or so it says on the web site. See the Hornaday site for more information.

http://www.hornady.com/story.php?s=483

JPK

Edited by JPK (12/11/06 01:14 AM)

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400NitroExpress
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Re: Hornady 450/400 3inch [Re: JPK]
      #65702 - 12/11/06 03:45 AM

Kynoch's original standards for this cartridge were for a 400 grain bullet at 2,125 fps IN A 30" BARREL (you'll also find this data on Kynoch's website). Late run 60 Cordite Kynoch runs 2,050 fps in 24" barrels with good throats. From 1920 to 1973 Kynoch was the ONLY commercial loader of this cartridge. Of the .450/.400 3" rifles in service today, 95+% are pre-war British doubles that were regulated with the original Kynoch Cordite ammunition. It wouldn't make any sense to load factory ammunition for this cartridge that wouldn't regulate in most of the rifles chambered for it.

I was in fairly regular contact with the tech guys at Hornady during the development of this load, and again yesterday. Hornady went out of their way to match the original 60 Cordite Kynoch load exactly. Hornady's .400 pressure barrels are 24". Their 400 grain load gives 2,050 fps in 24" barrels, same as the original Kynoch. This load has NOT been limited due to concern over bore diameter variations. It duplicates the original load.

After WWII, Kynoch seems to have felt the need to compromise on the bullet diameter of the .400s, and thenceforward loaded both cartridges with .410" bullets. Shot great in both .411" and .408" guns. Hornady has done likewise. The results of their pressure testing in this regard were predictable. They tested full power loads with .410" bullets in both .410" and .408" pressure barrels. IIRC, the difference in pressure was something like 600 PSI.

Also, it is my understanding that the solid will not be their current design. It will be a copper sheathed, steel jacketed solid.
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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: Hornady 450/400 3inch [Re: 400NitroExpress]
      #65714 - 12/11/06 04:46 AM

400

Thanks for the info. Any good well constructed factory rounds coming available should do a lot of good for promoting NE cartridges for current use.

If someone is making ammo for it, who is making factory rifles? Ruger no. 1? Searcy doubles? Which other double makers - Heym perhaps?



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John aka NitroX

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Govt get out of our lives NOW!
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NitroXAdministrator
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Re: Hornady 450/400 3inch [Re: NitroX]
      #65717 - 12/11/06 04:59 AM

Info from the Hornady website from the link above in the thread:

450/400 Nitro Express 3"



Legendary performance from a cartridge that could only be made today.

First developed in 1902 as an all-around African cartridge, the original 450/400 Nitro Express 3" ammunition propelled a 400 gr. bullet to a muzzle velocity of just over 2100 fps. Over 100 years later, our engineers have replicated this African legend using modern technology and manufacturing process to perfect it.

Loaded with either a 400 gr. RN expanding bullet or FMJ-RN Solid, the NEW Hornady 450/400 NE 3" cartridges are perfect for modern single-shot rifles and the ideal ammo for hippo, buffalo and other thick-skinned game. Great pains were taken to ensure that this ammunition will regulate in double rifles.

Hornady's NEW 450/400 NE 3" takes an exceptional cartridge to new levels of perfection.


  • All components produced in-house to the most exacting specifications.
  • Newly-designed bullets are manufactured to 0.410" diameter and will perform safely in all rifles chambered for the 450/400 NE 3".
  • Cutting edge propellan technology delivers consistent performance from frigid arctic environments to the steamy heat of equatorial jungles.
  • Premium brass produced to the same tolerances as our Match brass.
  • Replicates original ballistics and is designed to regulate in doubles.



450/400 Nitro Express 3"

Bullet / muzzle / 100 yds / 200 yds / 300 yds

Velocity (fps)/Energy (ft/lb)
400 gr. RN 2050/3732 1815/2924 1595/2259

Trajectory Tables
400 gr. RN 1402/1746 -1.5 0.0 -10.0 -33.4

Velocity (fps)/Energy (ft/lb)
400 gr. FMJ-RN 2050/3732 1815/2924 1595/2259

Trajectory Tables
400 gr. FMJ-RN 1402/1746 -1.5 0.0 -10.0 -33.4

450/400 Nitro Express 3"

--------------------
John aka NitroX

...
Govt get out of our lives NOW!
"I love the smell of cordite in the morning."
"A Sharp spear needs no polish"

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400NitroExpress
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Reged: 26/11/03
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Re: Hornady 450/400 3inch [Re: NitroX]
      #65720 - 12/11/06 05:11 AM

John:

I agree. I'm really glad to see this come to fruition. Hornady seems to want to tap into the DR market, and that can only be good news for us. The first commercial runs of loaded ammo haven't been done yet, but they're sending me samples of the 9.3X74R and .450/.400 brass to test. Gotta be better than the A-Square and Bertram stuff.

Yeah, Ruger and Searcy. Chris is working on the Heym project. If he can get a few of those built, with the ammo out, those guns will be gone in a flash, and I'd be surprised if other DR makers didn't start making .400s again. They'd be fools not to.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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1885
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Re: Hornady 450/400 3inch [Re: 400NitroExpress]
      #65755 - 12/11/06 03:49 PM

Dang!!! I wish they'd do it in a 3-1/4"!!!

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400NitroExpress
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Re: Hornady 450/400 3inch [Re: 400NitroExpress]
      #66074 - 18/11/06 01:27 PM

The new Hornady .450/.400 3" and 9.3X74R brass came in today. These are samples of the new cases they sent for testing. Haven't shot any of it yet, but it sure is great looking brass.
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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

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hoppdoc
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Re: Hornady 450/400 3inch [Re: 400NitroExpress]
      #66672 - 09/12/06 09:00 PM

Sounds like great brass and ammo to play with prior to making SERIOUS ammo with other bullets for African game.

The Ruger may have to suffice as a toy until funds for a
Scoped 450/400 become available!! At least one could become familiar with the trajectory of the round---

Wonder if Merkel could be considering the 450/400 as a new Double round to offer? Small Market but wonder how they could make their gun lighter other than working the barrels?

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