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Brazos_Jack
.224 member


Reged: 28/02/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Texas, USA
Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle?
      #125624 - 02/02/09 03:48 AM

I’m thinking about a European style stalking rifle. Break action, light weight, preferably in a rimmed cartridge like 7x65R or 8x57JRS. I’d love a Merkel K-1, but I think they’re probably a bit steep. What do they cost new, in the US, now in the calibers I named?

How good a rifle was the now out of production Thompson Center TCR-83 and TCR-87 Aristocrat? Is anyone still making barrels for them? Good enough to be worth looking for? About what would an Aristocrat cost in nice shape these days?

How about the BRNO Effect? Are they going to be offered in the U.S.? How much do they cost? How do they compare to the Merkel? How do they compare to the TCR Aristocrat?

Any other suggestions?

I’d probably top it with something like a Leupold 1.75-6x32.

Brazos Jack

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mickey
.416 member


Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Brazos_Jack]
      #125636 - 02/02/09 06:23 AM

What do you consider affordable? There are a few Italian break actions for around $2000US.

For less you could take a Ruger #1 and have it slimmed down a bit and have a pretty decent single shot.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

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Brazos_Jack
.224 member


Reged: 28/02/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Texas, USA
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: mickey]
      #125640 - 02/02/09 06:51 AM

I want something convenient to break down for travel or back packing, so the Riger is out.

What are these Italian singles you mentioned? I don't know about them. I was hoping for something in the $1000 to $1500 range, but may have to stretch. Are these available in the U.S.?

I could add 6.5x57R to my possible caliber list. Interchangeable barrels would be preferable but not a deal breaker if I find something I like.

Brazos Jack

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tophet1
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Reged: 15/09/07
Posts: 1873
Loc: NSW, Australia
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Brazos_Jack]
      #125644 - 02/02/09 07:30 AM

Check out this Brno:

http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/9421043/m/662108199

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mickey
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Reged: 05/01/03
Posts: 4647
Loc: Pend Oreille Valley, Idaho
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: tophet1]
      #125650 - 02/02/09 09:39 AM

Sabatti, I think a couple of others. They make a pretty decent little rifle for the price and in any caliber you would want.

http://www.sabatti.it/eng/framesetbasculanti.htm

I doubt the lower priced models would come with the nice engraving.

--------------------
Lovu Zdar
Mick

A Man of Pleasure, Enterprise, Wit and Spirit Rare Books, Big Game Hunting, English Rifles, Fishing, Explosives, Chauvinism, Insensitivity, Public Drunkenness and Sloth, Champion of Lost and Unpopular Causes.

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JabaliHunter
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Reged: 16/05/07
Posts: 1958
Loc: England
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: mickey]
      #125725 - 03/02/09 07:57 AM

Cheap, but tough as old boots if the shotguns are anything to go by - Baikal single shot
Don't know if imported to the US, but see http://www.yorkguns.co.uk/baikal_rifles.php
no rimmed cartridges by the looks of it though.

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Marrakai
.416 member


Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3494
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: JabaliHunter]
      #125736 - 03/02/09 01:49 PM

JH:
The CBC single-shot is a far better option than the Baikal, much better fit and finish for essentially the same low dollar.

Neither of these are really European-style, other than both being hammerless break-action.

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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Brazos_Jack
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Reged: 28/02/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Texas, USA
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Marrakai]
      #125739 - 03/02/09 03:07 PM

Quote:

JH:
The CBC single-shot is a far better option than the Baikal, much better fit and finish for essentially the same low dollar.

Neither of these are really European-style, other than both being hammerless break-action.



Marrakai,

What is a CBC single shot?

Brazos Jack

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3494
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Brazos_Jack]
      #125760 - 03/02/09 11:18 PM

BJ:
Made in Brasil by Companhia Brasileira de Cartuchos, actually had a look at one in my gunsafe (a .410 shotgun) and they do have a hammer, but partially enclosed. I looked for the range of chamberings on the web, but not much about them is forthcoming. They are common and popular in Australia, probably equal to Baikal, especially as cheap 12-bore single-barrel shotguns. They also make a strong no-nonsense centre-fire single-shot rifle.

Oh, and they are the makers of Magtech ammunition.

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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Tatume
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Reged: 09/06/07
Posts: 1091
Loc: Gloucester, Va USA
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Marrakai]
      #125762 - 03/02/09 11:27 PM

The H&R single shot break open rifles are dependable and accurate. They come with a Weaver-type scope base installed. I routinely break down my 270 Win H&R into three sub assemblies, barrel, stock/action, and scope. The Weaver rings return to zero.

--------------------
Take care, Tom
NRA Life Member

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Marrakai
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Reged: 09/01/03
Posts: 3494
Loc: Darwin, Top End of Australia
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Marrakai]
      #125764 - 03/02/09 11:27 PM

OK, finally found the CBC web-site here.

Doesn't look like they currently offer the single-shot rifle. Also, the current single-barrel shotgun (Mod 199) is quite different from those commonly seen here, in that it has an under-lever by the looks.

Oh well.....

--------------------
Marrakai
When the bull drops, the bullshit stops!
--------------------------------
www.marrakai-adventure.com.au

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Tatume
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Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Marrakai]
      #125780 - 04/02/09 05:50 AM

It would appear there are two different threads going with the same subject line.

--------------------
Take care, Tom
NRA Life Member

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Brazos_Jack
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Reged: 28/02/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Texas, USA
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Tatume]
      #125829 - 04/02/09 10:09 PM

Quote:

It would appear there are two different threads going with the same subject line.



I somehow accidentally double posted this here and in the Double Rifle forum where it does not belong. ( http://forums.nitroexpress.com/showflat....7326#Post125828 ) I have posted there to stop that thread and come here.

There was a good post there by farshot:

"I picked up a BRNO Effect in 30-06. It was not my first choice as I would have gone with the 8x57R.

It is a trim handy rifle that shoots very very well. Under MOA without working a load up (using 180 gr Federal Fusion factory)

The scope mount is the normal BRNO (which I love ) 16 mm dovetail.

Extractor only - which is the only drawback in our cold climate as you need to flick the shell out after it has been lifted. The normal thin steel lip extractor as compared to the wonderous design of the Merkel extractor for non-rimmed rounds.

New they are around $1400 Cdn - I picked mine up for much less.

The finish is good enough on decent wood, but, like their new doubles, the 800 series, the receiver has cheap looking lettering and "engraving" - they should have just left it plain.

I may be biased to BRNO but I do like this rifle. It is very light and handy with a crisp adjustable double trigger with the front being a set trigger.

The top break lever can cock the rifle from a closed un-cocked position by moving it to the right.

I have looked closely at the Merkel and they are very very nice rifles and by the time you do the scope mount system, it does add up in cost."

This looks like it might be what I'm looking for. 1400 CDN is about $1134 USD at today's exchange rate. That would fit my budget. I am hoping that farshot joins this thread here and gives more info including what he actually paid for his BRNO Effect and maybe post some pics.

I would like to have the ability to have multiple interchangable barrels but I have read elsewhere that this is not going to happen with the BRNO. It is probably beyond their machining capability to maintain the requisit close tolerances. But still, it's less than half the cost of a Merkel or Blaser, so I could just buy another rifle eventually if I decided on a different caliber. Right now I'm leaning toward the 6.5x57R with the 7x65R a close 2nd.

Brazos Jack

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tarawa
.333 member


Reged: 21/10/07
Posts: 420
Loc: South Florida
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Brazos_Jack]
      #125857 - 05/02/09 07:09 AM

If your rifle doesn't have to be single shot CDNN Investments was still selling the O&U Baikal 30-06s for under $300.00 plus shipping.. I am selling one with a scope and mounts (CZ) for $450.00

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Life is for Service

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farshot
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Reged: 25/01/06
Posts: 106
Loc: Alberta Canada
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Brazos_Jack]
      #125858 - 05/02/09 07:09 AM

I have read a post concerning the BRNO 110 and saw some pictures in the Acurate Reloading site and really the Effect may be the latest version of the BRNO 99.5 or 110. I have never seen one of those rifles up close so I cannot comment on that, but it sure looks similar externally.

I will try and get some pictures done - I haven't posted pictures before on this sight but I will perhaps send them via email to Brazos who can post them.

I do not see the bbls being interchangable in this model.

I also do not see the 6.5 x 57R as a choice in the list at the one dealer who actually mentions them.

In Canada I see the .243, .308, .30-06, 8x57R and 7x65R - they are not generally available and I was told by the inmporter here that they would all be pay in advance 100%,special orders.

I bought mine slightly used from a fellow who thought the recoil was a bit much. Like all BRNOs it is slightly heavier then the Merkel and of course less elegant in wood, technical details and styling. But I fully expect the Efefct to still be shooting many years from now as they all appear to do.

I would be interested to see if they are available in the American market and the price.

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Brazos_Jack
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Reged: 28/02/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Texas, USA
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: farshot]
      #125900 - 05/02/09 05:13 PM

I really want one (or more) of these BRNO Effects.

Problem is that even though it’s probably made in all the appropriate calibers - 6.5x57R, 7x57R, 7x65R, & 8x57JRS – I’ve heard that the num nuts at CZUSA are planning to only import it in a handful of rimless American calibers like .308 & .30-06.

I'm really hoping that CZUSA can be persuaded to import these in the appropriate metric calibers such as 6.5x57R, 7x57R, 7x65R, and 8x57JRS. I think that the rimless extractor on this thing is less that stellar and rimless U.S. calibers aren't really the market for this style rifle anyway. I also think the more powerful rimmed cartridges like the .30R Blaser, 8x75R and 9.3x74R are inappropriate in a light European style stalking rifle. They'd kick like a Missouri mule. In fact I'll bet the .30-06 is a bit emphatic in that department.

I'm planning to email and/or call CZUSA to try to convince them that the real market for a European style kipplauf in this price range is in rimmed European calibers. I just have to hope that CZ USA can be convinced to realize that the market for an $1100 to $1200 break open single shot European stalking rifle is not for .308's and .30-06's. I think anyone interested in an '06 single will not see a reason to pay several hundred over the cost of a Ruger No1 for this.

I hope any of you that are interested will contact CZUSA and tell them what calibers you are interested in.

Their site is blocked where I am right now, but I managed to get their contact info off Google:

CZ-USA
P.O. Box 171073
Kansas City, KS 66117-0073
E-mail: info@cz-usa.com
1 800 955-4486
(913) 321-1811
(913) 321-2251
www.cz-usa.com/about_contacts.php

Brazos Jack

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JabaliHunter
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Reged: 16/05/07
Posts: 1958
Loc: England
Re: Affordable European Style Stalking Rifle? [Re: Brazos_Jack]
      #127678 - 21/02/09 10:51 PM

Like this? http://auctions.holtandcompany.co.uk/asp...5&saletype=

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