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Double Rifles, Single Shots & Combinations >> Single Shots & Combination Guns

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Brian
.224 member


Reged: 03/02/05
Posts: 41
Loc: NY (Delaware County)
8 Bore ammo development.
      #66721 - 10/12/06 03:10 PM

I just got my 8 bore single. Now its time to start accumulating componenets, cases, etc to load this beast. I ahve no experience with it. ANyone have any pointers on loading, tools and making them, bullets, molds.
The gun has 838 groove. 828 bore according to the builder. He used an .846 diameter ball when working up the load and sights. Is that correct? I would like to either try that or maybe a short foster type conical. any suggestions.
Plastic or brass. I know I iwll have to use brass for hunting. I am all ears.

--------------------
Brian

LTC, IN
Back from Afghanistan
Life Member A.H. Fox Gun Collectors Assoc.
Endowment Member NRA
Delaware County, NY


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gatsby
.375 member


Reged: 05/09/05
Posts: 862
Loc: inland valley CA USA
Re: 8 Bore ammo development. [Re: Brian]
      #66791 - 11/12/06 01:58 PM

Brian,
Congradulations on your 8. Contact Rocky Mountain Cartridge for your brass, Ballistics products and Circlefly for your wads. Check the NEI site for molds both roundball and conical. T Bland 8 bores are usually 10 dram 3 1/4 inch guns. Use Swiss FFg for your black powder loads. There is a nitro for black conversion load using blue dot if you are interested. I have some 8 gauge plastic industrial cases. Send me a PM if you want to try some in your rifle. I need to swage the base as they are sold with a ring near the bottom of the base to prevent them from being chambered in a gun.
I also have some paradox bullets that cast 1250gr .835 diameter that might work in your gun.You can assemble some loads using a minimal amount of reloading equipment, a mallet, a punch, a hard metal surface, a pair of pliers and some wire.

--------------------
"Recoil is insignificant when there is a tiger on the head of your elephant" The Maharaja of Cooch Behar



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Omnivorous_Bob
.333 member


Reged: 03/10/05
Posts: 285
Loc: Montana
Re: 8 Bore ammo development. [Re: Brian]
      #67137 - 15/12/06 09:00 PM

Beautiful gun! Congrates and enjoy, and please keep us posted on your progress/load development, and any hunting you do with this beast so we can join you vicariously. Was Giles W. by chance the maker/converter of this beauty?

Gatsby, I also assemble my loads via the low tech mallet/anvil/punch method, but I'm curious what you use the pliers and wire for? Always looking for good advice. Thanks, Bob

--------------------
"If we're not supposed to eat animals, how come they're made out of meat?"


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tinker
.416 member


Reged: 12/03/05
Posts: 4835
Loc: Nevada
Re: 8 Bore ammo development. [Re: Omnivorous_Bob]
      #67168 - 16/12/06 03:40 AM

I'm interested in hearing about the blue dot NFB conversion.
What's the formula, and how are the pressures/velocities?


--Tinker

--------------------
--Self-Appointed Colonel, DRSS--



"It IS a dangerous game, and so named for a reason, and you can't play from the keyboard. " --Some Old Texan...


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gatsby
.375 member


Reged: 05/09/05
Posts: 862
Loc: inland valley CA USA
Re: 8 Bore ammo development. [Re: Omnivorous_Bob]
      #67199 - 16/12/06 01:57 PM

Bob,
You use the wire and pliers to put a crimp on the waist of your conical bullets when loading them in paper or plastic cases. You could do this with your 10 when shooting conicals in plastic cases.

--------------------
"Recoil is insignificant when there is a tiger on the head of your elephant" The Maharaja of Cooch Behar



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Omnivorous_Bob
.333 member


Reged: 03/10/05
Posts: 285
Loc: Montana
Re: 8 Bore ammo development. [Re: gatsby]
      #67265 - 17/12/06 12:38 PM

Thanks Gatsby, I hadn't thought of that. I tried Blue Dot (70gn) in my Bland for the first time last weekend. It was snowing so hard I didn't bother to set up the chrono but they felt good for a 'moderate' pracitce round. First 2 shots were touching 2" high at 25yds, the last 2 (of 8) it was all I could do to keep'em in the 8" ring at 50. Really, I don't have a problem, I can stop anytime I want...honest!

Brian, my loading method is certainly low tech, but after much trial and error works ok for me.

I start by placing the primer on a flat metal plate and inserting an undersized wooden dow into the case and gently tapping it home with a mallet(with safety glasses, fingers clear in case of discharge, no powder or other primers near, etc). I used to dump the charge through a 5' droptube, but couldn't determine any benefit, so now just pour it into the case. I then gently compress the charge with another dowel with notches on the side to verify the amount.

Next, I seat a thick tightly fitting cardboard wad over the powder, again with a dow. I either cut these with scissors or preferably punch them out of the thickest solid cardboard I can find such as tablet backing at a minimum. Using tablet backing over BP it seems like about 1/4 of them fail and get blown through, but with no appartent effect other than burning into the wad.

I then seat the thickest felt wads I can find (compressing with a dowel)to bring the height up to the base of the bullet. I lube the wads by melting wonder lube (preferable)or bore butter in a thin tray (like a styrofoam meat tray) in the microwave at low power and then rolling the wad in the liquid to lube the sides. It's messy so I do'em in big batches and let them cool on wax paper or foil. If you don't lube the felt will be charred from the powder gasses, but lubed ones seal tightly and look pristine after firing in a clean bore. I save mine and have even loaded them again after cleaning and relubing. That sealing can also let you get by with a slightly undersized bullet w/o leading issues, assumuing accuracy is ok. I seat bullets by hand and don't crimp in my single. Sometimes bullets have to be rotated repeatedly to work the trapped air from the case and get the bullet firmly seated on the top wad.

I deprime with a punch and mallet with the case seated in a recessed anvil, then wash throughly in hot soapy water and tumble the cases in porcelain beads/soap/water to clean gunk from the insides.

One caution that I'll add reference to compressing the powder, is that while the BP loads I've used generally have an extreme spread of <10fps, I usually load the ammo the day prior to firing. Last week I pulled bullets from several rounds that were loaded a year ago that had been shuffled around in transit to the point I was unsure which charge of which powder each contained. The BP was 'chunky', to say the least, and some had to be scraped from the case. The BPCR experts here probably know if that is a concern or not, but I don't.

By no means is this authoritative, just based on tips from others and it works ok for me. If anyone has any tips or better ideas, I'm all ears too! Please do keep us posted on this great rifle.

Bob

--------------------
"If we're not supposed to eat animals, how come they're made out of meat?"

Edited by Omnivorous_Bob (17/12/06 04:43 PM)


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Brian
.224 member


Reged: 03/02/05
Posts: 41
Loc: NY (Delaware County)
Re: 8 Bore ammo development. [Re: Omnivorous_Bob]
      #67270 - 17/12/06 02:50 PM

Can I assume this technique is with plastic cases??

Do you load Brass?

What about a roll crimp for the bullets or balls?

--------------------
Brian

LTC, IN
Back from Afghanistan
Life Member A.H. Fox Gun Collectors Assoc.
Endowment Member NRA
Delaware County, NY


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Omnivorous_Bob
.333 member


Reged: 03/10/05
Posts: 285
Loc: Montana
Re: 8 Bore ammo development. [Re: Brian]
      #67281 - 17/12/06 04:11 PM

Brian, all of the above was for my brass cased 4. I've used similar techniques w/a 10 roundball gun with brass and also with roll crimped plastic cases, but with fiber rather than felt (prefered IMO) wads. I've heard many stories of BP burning through plastic cases (will no harmful effect) on the first firing but have never encountered it myself with federal 10 cases and healthy doses of Fg, FFg and FFFg, for what it's worth.

Bob

--------------------
"If we're not supposed to eat animals, how come they're made out of meat?"


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JohnTheGreek
.300 member


Reged: 16/11/04
Posts: 167
Loc: Cairo, Egypt
Re: 8 Bore ammo development. [Re: Omnivorous_Bob]
      #79730 - 01/06/07 05:34 PM

Accuracy might only need to be "minute of elephant" but it still might help to know the twist in the bbl. I assume your builder worked up a load and the sight using 10 drams of black (swiss)?

John


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